« Strikeforce 4/17 in Nashville: A make-or-break event for the company on CBS | Home | Dana White explains why UFC’s production team will run the WEC PPV in Sacramento »
Strikeforce turns into a ____fest on CBS; Bad ratings numbers arrive
By Zach Arnold | April 17, 2010
Update (4/18): Dave Meltzer reports — “The overnight ratings for last night’s Strikeforce saw the 9-11 regular airing of Strikeforce do a 1.0 rating in adults 18-49 and 2.63 million viewers. Completely bombed.” Bloody Elbow compares past MMA ratings on CBS.
—
When I previewed this event earlier in the week, I listed several key points that would indicate whether this would be a make-or-break show. After watching tonight’s show on CBS, one thing is clear — the promotion absolutely is screwed as far as future live telecasts on CBS is concerned.
There was no reason whatsoever to book three “title fights” in a 2-hour time block. First of all, the title belts mean very little to the fans watching the show. Second, it guarantees that each fight could go five rounds. And they did. 75 minutes of largely boring action, combined with commercials, ring introductions, and what you have are some unbelievably pissed off network affiliates across America screaming that their 11 PM news casts got postponed because of a low-rated MMA event that draws a bunch of people who likely aren’t going to watch network news telecasts. This was exactly why I indicated that if Strikeforce didn’t have everything go its way that it would force the promotion to consider a tape-delayed broadcast in the future in order to save the CBS deal. (See: Bellator’s shows on FSN versus their tightly-edited show on Telemundo HD the next day.)
As for the fights shown on CBS, these were not the kind of fights that hardcore fight fans were anticipating watching. Why? The hardcore fans are tired out. They’ve watched so much MMA this calendar year that once the action started to get boring, changing the channel became a lot less painless to do. I’m sure this happened across the country. There is such a thing as MMA fatigue right now. All the Strikeforce fights going to a decision did not endear the promotion to anyone.
It was hard for the casual fans who tuned in to really care about the match-ups in general. As we saw with Aoki, nobody knew what DREAM was. Nobody knew there was an “interpromotional feud” going on. If anything, what we saw with the lack of promotion by Strikeforce and Showtime on this front was a microcosm of the way Showtime has promoted the company since Scott Coker signed a business deal with them.
Winners
Jake Shields – He not only beat a name who is a big deal in the eyes of casual MMA fans, he did it with relative ease in the finishing rounds. And, to top it off, Shields openly said before the fight that Dan Henderson had no idea how to defend off his back and that he would exploit it.
Shields fought as well as he could have. He can’t punch and he will get punished for it when (I said when) he heads to UFC. A fight against Josh Koscheck right now would be fascinating to watch. Koscheck would bring the leather and would also give Shields a real good test defensively. As a #1 contender’s match for St. Pierre’s Welterweight belt, I would definitely dig that (should Koscheck beat Daley in Montreal). If Paul Daley beats Koscheck, then Shields would have to fight St. Pierre right away.
Shields fought a guy much bigger than him and won with skill. Good for him.
Dana White – Everything that could have gone wrong for Strikeforce and Showtime did. And everything that needed to go right for the UFC President went exactly right.
Shields gets his big win over Dan Henderson. Now it’s going to cost a ton for Strikeforce to keep Shields or they will have to let him go to the big show. Henderson losing in the fashion he did and for how much he got paid to fight also validates White’s strategy of letting Strikeforce financially sink itself with such a heavy contract. Third, while Strikeforce had a good crowd on television for presentation, this organization is struggling to find an identity and is struggling to figure out what it wants to do and how it wants to go about doing it. Right now, they just put on some shows and that’s about it.
UFC – As far as rankings lists go, you can practically count on more non-UFC guys getting shedded off of lists and more UFC talent filling in those new slots.
Losers
Dan Henderson – Financially, I still think he would have made more as a PPV headliner in UFC than what’s he getting with Strikeforce. Physically, he’s looks in great shape but MMA is a very unforgiving business as far as fighting Father Time is concerned. I only consider Henderson a minor loser tonight because I don’t think a lot of people watched this CBS event and I expect that the fans that did watch will largely forget about this loss or not care all that much.
As for Henderson’s reaction from the crowd on Saturday night, I’m going to use a dreaded pro-wrestling analogy (but hang with me if you follow wrestling. Otherwise, skip this part.) Dan Henderson in Strikeforce is like Jeff Hardy in TNA. In WWE, Jeff Hardy was one of the most passionately-cared about wrestlers in 2009. When he went to TNA, the WWE fans in large part don’t pay attention or don’t know. It doesn’t mean that they forgot who Jeff Hardy is, but they’re not watching him in TNA. Hell, a bunch of WWE fans probably think he’s on vacation. Same with Henderson — he’s fighting in a smaller promotion and while the show is on CBS, I don’t think tonight’s loss will be as damaging to his career as it would have been in the UFC cage.
Scott Coker – The matchmaking right now sucks. There’s no promotional rhythm. Any goodwill the promotion has right is gone. Signing away a lot of the control to Showtime is proving to be a negative in terms of creative control. The promotional champions mean nothing. Nothing the promotion has done lately has been a positive impact on the business.
DREAM – Both Gegard Mousasi and Shin’ya Aoki put in worthless performances. I can’t reveal where I had both men ranked on my personal MMA rankings list, but I can say that I looked at Mousasi definitely as a top 10 Lightweight and I had Aoki in the Top 10 of Lightweights (albeit not as high as others). I will say that I had Crusher Kawajiri ranked significantly higher than him and I’m glad that I did. Would a Kawajiri/Melendez re-match turn out the same way that the first one did?
Is it safe to say that the shiny pants are to Aoki what brass knuckles used to be to an old-school pro-wrestling heel?
Other thoughts
Gilbert Melendez needs to head to UFC as soon as he possibly can.
King Mo now the 205-pound promotional champion. Do you feel that he is one of the Top 5 Lightweights in the world?
Gus Johnson is great as a basketball commentator. Even though his call of Seth Petruzelli knocking out Kimbo Slice is incredibly memorable, Gus is not a natural fit for MMA PBP. It showed on Saturday night.
I don’t want to hear anyone in Strikeforce talk about “cool match-ups” being their motivation to bring some Japanese influence to their promotion. Like everyone else who isn’t UFC, it seems that all the MMA promotions follow what happens in Japan religiously but take none of the elements that made Japanese MMA so special and apply it to their own product. The biggest element missing? Japanese-style production on the broadcast side. Yes, I know Fuji TV and TBS are producing K-1 events, but look how many years ahead of the curve they are compared to who is producing the MMA events Stateside.
A note on Mayhem Miller — If Strikeforce is WCW to UFC’s WWE, then Mayhem decided to pull a Tito Kevin Nash Ortiz bit and get some self-promotion. We know he’s a self-promoter and he’s good at it. It’s his best skill. He’s no dummy. If anything, Miller just got attention for himself. People who are screaming that this was a travesty are caught up in the moment. Like Strikeforce itself, most fans will completely forget that this happened in a month or so.
Unless, of course, he finds himself in legal/criminal trouble after tonight.
I didn’t think the post fight brawl at Strikeforce marred anything. It was entertaining. It’s cage fighting. How much decorum you want?
The post fight fight was enhanced by Gus Johnson yelling “Gentlemen, we’re on national television!” Gentlemen? High comedy.
The post fight brawl had more action than 2 of the 3 actual fights.
I can’t be offended by a fight at a cage fight.
Did Gus think “national television” would get some gentlemen to say, “oh, damn, I forgot. I better stop kicking this dude in the head then.”
Topics: Media, MMA, StrikeForce, UFC, Zach Arnold | 91 Comments » | Permalink | Trackback |
I turned over after the HBO fights were done.
Wow.
It wouldn’t shock me if Strikeforce is over and done at CBS.
This is not good for MMA that’s for sure. Although Dana is going to be happy as hell for a few days. It takes heat off the Anderson Silva performance. Really bad card with only one highlight reel moment. And it was one that’s negative for the sport.
And….I know this isn’t exactly the smartest thing to do…But on YouTube comments page on a video showing the brawl…Can anyone confirm this or heard something about this?
TenTr0n @BossVATO yeah….its on the local news right now….insane….22 year old college kid died. Cops shot tear gas and everything. I guess the parking lot brawl started because Mayhem? Miller was be escorted out by the cops….and he started yelling at the crowd. The crowd rioted i guess and someone is dead now….im sure mayhem miller is in big trouble….the lead him off in a cop car hand cuffed – Posted 16 minutes ago
Sure hope that’s not the case.
Isn’t Mayhem still on felony probation in Georgia?
Some guy posted about this on Twitter as well.
It never happened, nobody died there was no riot.
without a long term deal, Strikeforce has always been one card away from losing the CBS deal…..
Henderson showed his age. Shields showed he is a legit contender. Mousasi lost any sort of value to a guy who obviously would have troubled against the upper echelon of the UFC.
Can people STOP ranking Japanese fighters in the top 5. Aoki showed that the Japanese are not top level guys. The top 5 lightweights should be…. Edgar, Penn, Florian, Maynard, and Melendez….
Coker is screwed. He bet the house on Henderson. Now he is going go lose the guy who beat him to the UFC in 2010….. This is exactly why smaller organizations should not risk everything on one fighter….
Overall, what a boring card. This was horrible on so
Manu levels
45 Huddle,
You think that the card was subpar, but do you like what happened, since, in the end, this might be the proverbial straw that broke the camels back?
I mean, maybe there should only be one MMA org (outside of very small regional shows) in North America.
“Can people STOP ranking Japanese fighters in the top 5. Aoki showed that the Japanese are not top level guys.”
Uh- Aoki was not in the top 5 for being Japanese, he was in the top 5 because he beat guys like Eddie Alvarez and Hellboy
It’s a cycle. Over-rated dude in Japan beats another over-rated dude in Japan and now he’s legit top 10. Another over-rated dude in Japan also beats him, and now he’s top 10 too. That’s how Alvarez, Hansen, Aoki, and JZ all wound up there. Now it turns out that top dog in Japanese promotions is just a middle of the road fighter against real competition.
I think it has a lot to do with rules and surroundings in this case. Aoki couldn’t wear his grappling pants which give him more traction and he wasn’t prepared to get smashed up against the cage while on the ground which prevents him from doing anything.
I agree, I think people are overreacting to the post fight brawl a bit. This is not a black eye that will set MMA back 10 years. Merely a blip on the radar, that people will forget about in a week.
If, Strikeforce pulls in big numbers for this card (which they won’t) CBS would not bat one eye leash about some post fight brawl in the cage.
You can one more loser to the list “causal MMA fan” because causal MMA is not going to sit through three MMA title fights that go the distance. Two being below average and the main event being largely one sided after round one.
I enjoyed rounds one and two of King Mo vs. Mousasi, round one of Melendez vs. Aoki ( and a few other brief moments beyond that during that fight).
Jake Shields’ grappling wizardry over Dan Henderson for 20 minutes was good theater to me, but don’t know how it appeared to the audience CBS/SF is trying to capture
Dana White\’s twitter:
đ
That pretty much sums it up. I imagine we\’ll get an interview in a day or two and he\’ll be the smuggest Dana we\’ve seen since Pride went under.
LOL @ thinking the matchmaking was bad. They put the best against the best they had instead of putting their champs in against 5-1 underdogs. Even match making sometimes ends up with slower fights and the oddsmaker dogs winning. Not the best night of fights, but all three were interesting from a fight & promotional perspective IMO.
There’s more to matchmaking than simply “this guy is a 3-to-1 favorite.” There’s the ability to book matches based on styles and what will most likely produce the best, most exciting outcome.
Since Javier Mendez has gotten out of the slot as booker (he’s with American Kickboxing Academy), the booking has gone downhill.
Strikeforce needs elbows on the ground or these long, boring grappling matches will continue.
What a disaster.
I doubt SF will be back on CBS again. At least as a live event. Every affiliate in the country is going to go nuts that the local news got blown out. Local news are how affiliates make money. The station I watched on apologized three times during the news for it being on so late. CBS will have affiliates electing to air reruns instead of SF next time or telling it that they will dump out at 11pm and go to live local news.
I don’t know why it took 2 hours to air two fights to begin with. Shields and Hendo didn’t start until about 11 on the nose.
Also I wonder what people thought when they tuned in for the news and saw Hendo and Shields rolling around like Achilles and Patroclus. Not good.
By and large those fights sucked.
I enjoyed seeing Mousassi get exposed. Just as I predicted and was widely ridiculed here months ago. Big “I told ya so” for several of my fellow posters here. Mousassi is not that good, you can now drop him from your silly top 10 lists. And please don’t put King Mo in his spot. He would get destroyed in UFC. At least right now. I think Mo has the potential to develop if he can learn to work his hands. Mousassi needs to go back to 195. That’s the right weight for him and with a win or two he can be grotesquely overrated at that weight.
I changed the channel during the first round of Melendez/Aoki. What a s___show. Just terrible. I flipped over to Spike because I thought they were showing Mir/Carwin. But it was UFC 110 which I guess was the Australia show. How the hell can anyone keep track of this crap anymore. At that point I flipped on 3:10 to Yuma. I’ve seen that before and I think it is one of the 5 worst movies ever made. But I watched that instead of the Melendez fight. That’s when I had a come to Jesus moment. My girlfriend and I (she’s a huge MMA fan, very knowledgeable) got to talking. MMA sucks right now. There are way too many shows and not nearly enough fighters of quality to put on this many shows. Also we’re in an awful period of fighting. Everyone is equally as mediocre at all of the various arts as each other and you get these constant stalemate fights. I thought 2001-2003 when all the guard and half guard guys were dominating was the worst phase ever of MMA. I was so relieved as strikers began to learn to nullify the guard and make fights more dynamic. That’s one of the key reasons MMA had the boom it did in 04-05. As much of a reason as TUF. If one of these fights tonight had happened instead of Griffin/Bonnar, MMA would have died on the spot.
As for the stupid brawl at the end it must have been staged. Otherwise they wouldn’t have shown it in slo-mo after coming back from commercial. They also would have edited it out on the West Coast (where I saw the show).
Also the announcing tonight was the worst I’ve ever heard. And I think Rogan and Goldie suck. But I’ve never heard more biased announcing than the 3 guys rooting for Mousassi during the first three rounds. That was Bobby the Brain and Jesse the Body bad. And then what the hell were they doing, trying to set up Shamrock vs Shields from the announce booth during the fight? If Scott Coker is going to force Shields to fight one more time for him and have it be against Frank Shamrock, then he should just quit promoting MMA right now. And check into a retard facility.
Back to my come to Jesus moment. Aside from Shogun/Machida II and the Brock/Carwin fight I’m going to wait until the day after MMA events now and check the results online then go watch the good fights.
I forgot to mention:
Why did these fights need to be 5 round title fights? None of them had any significance except maybe Shields/Hendo.
Just because a fight is for a title doesn’t mean anything if the title is worthless.
We could do a card next week and have it be:
Me vs Zach
45 vs Alan
Smoogy vs IceMuncher
A.Tavares vs Fluyid
That’s 1,2.3,4 count ’em and count ’em again, 4 title fights. Big F’n Deal as Joe Biden would say.
The Strikeforce titles have about as much relevance to the world of MMA as the sandwich I ate for lunch today. And that was a real good sandwich, unlike the fights tonight.
I’ve wanted to write something like this for awhile, but then I feel like a retard typing this all out and then thinking, “Why do I even care enough to write this?”
Too many PPVs, too many people in all aspects of the sport focusing on promoting mediocrity, too much spectacle, etc etc etc. A friend of mine made the point that no MMA fight in the history of the sport was as good as Gatti/Ward I, and that was just a couple club boxers throwing shots. He’s right. I guess I’d rather watch club boxing than main event level MMA? Oh well.
It’s a different sport. It’s like saying basketball isn’t as good as football because nobody gets tackled. Takedowns make the difference. The majority of fighters in America are wrestlers who would instantly takedown somebody just looking to slug. That’s MMA. If you don’t like it anymore then so be it, but writing it off for going in a talent slump is just as silly as the “boxing is dead” crowd’s dumb comments.
I get that “there are takedowns”. I am not asking for more shitty kickboxing under the guise of MMA. The problem for me is that the average MMA fight that goes to decision lasts about as long as a 6 rounder in boxing, and so we rarely get to see guys make epic comebacks on the cards or the kind of back and forth action seen in even low level boxing wars like Gatti/Ward. The closest we get to it in MMA are fights like Ricco/Couture and Rampage/Forrest. Those are fights that are literally once every 5 year type occurences, and the matchmaking and demands of what the promotions want from their fighters only further ensure that they’ll be increasingly less likely to happen.
The short answer is that MMA isn’t intended to appeal to people like me; the fanbase for the sport right now are pro wrestling fans and college frat boys who want to see a billion knockouts. Its never going to start acting like a sport, so why should I sit here and complain that it won’t? I suppose that’s good enough reason to not so regularly post here anymore while the people who want what it is that MMA currently offers cheer endlessly. :shrug:
Tell him to watch Fisher vs. Stout.
And on top of that didn’t they win FOTY twice?
Who, Gatti/Ward? Great PR from the first fight carried Gatti for a long, long time after.
Fisher/Stout was a generic 15 minute bite-sized scrap from 4 years ago that no one even remembers. I didn’t even remember it. There’s a lot of meaningless fights between journeymen like that, but no one goes touting Aaron Riley/Yves Edwards or fights similar to it as the gold standard of anything.
Very true, but it’s not like either were that big of stars before their series of fights.
Gatti was known most for getting his ass handed to him, and them coming from behind and winning. But, lets not act like either guy was a great fighter.
I guess a better comparison would be Bonnar vs. Forrest.
Gatti had been pretty heavily promoted by HBO. Ward had a lot of TV appearances. Both were much bigger stars than either Griffin or Bonnar were going into that first bout.
Yea he was promoted by HBO heavily, but he was also looked at as a guy who’s not Championship caliber. He had been dispatched throughout his career by better boxers like ODH, Robinson and Angel manfredy.
Come to think about it Scott Smith is starting to turn into MMA’s version of Gatti.
Gatti won world titles even before he was basically handed a garbage belt at 140. Its not as if he was totally unknown; he was an action fighter. That was his gig. I remember when HBO ran a graphic during the Leija/Ward fight they televised showing “Top Action Fighters” (Gatti among them) and discussed the possibility of the fight coming off even then, well before it was actually booked.
Returning to my point I made, it doesn’t necessarily have to be a “standup fight” to be comparable. Ricco/Couture and Frank Shamrock/Tito weren’t really stand-up bang out wars but are all time classics anyways. The standard of what a great fight is for MMA is, I think, quite a bit lower – you see a lot of fights that are sub 10 minutes and ones where skill is at a minimum be suggested. Frye/Tank and Frye/Takayama would both probably show up in a lot of top 10s even now.
Three guys holding Miller and Nick still couldn’t get the takedown.
I definitely don’t agree this was a bad card on paper, it was just a bunch of bad results. A tape delayed Strikeforce show is an awful idea and won’t save anything. As we’ve seen with even UFC’s international tape delayed shows people do not like watching MMA events that aren’t live, it loses a certain feeling even if you don’t know the results. And what would they have done if this show was tape delayed? Cut up the fights to make them shorter like PRIDE on FSN? That would have been terrible. They advertised 3 fights that turned out to be boring, they would have to deliver on the promise live or taped. You can’t tell the audience “sorry, these fights sucked, here’s our prelims with a bunch of guys you don’t know.” And CBS clearly wanted them to go into the 11pm over run because they never would have shown Mayhem’s fight highlight to eat up time if they were in a rush.
If Dan Henderson had stamina he would have won the fight since Shields has nothing but a great ability at takedowns and laying. In a few months when Shields is in the UFC there will be a internet revelation that he is “exposed” if you can buck or even have a good sprawl. So if Josh Koscheck, who fights like a young Dan Henderson with fantastic grappling and KO power, were to fight him he couldn’t have used that strategy because Koscheck wouldn’t lay there and accept taking baby-punches for 3 minutes a round. And he won’t out-grapple GSP or even Jon Fitch. He’ll be way out of his league in UFC in Middleweight (where Marquardt and Sonnen would beat him before Silva does) or Welterweight (where Koscheck and Fitch would beat him before GSP does.)
Aoki was fighting on a half-assed training camp. He did not train in a cage, he couldn’t handle the rule changes (especially the constant stand-ups.) Yes, there was no doubt Melendez was going to win because he looked like he had 30 pounds on Aoki and Aoki would have to fight at 145 if he was in America full-time. But I don’t think he deserves to have his past successes taken away just because he looked like crap against a significantly larger opponent under a very different rule set than DREAM. Although I’m sure if the rematch does happen in DREAM Gilbert will win that one too. But it will be closer. And Yamasaki had one crappy move after another: calling for a stand up twice as punches were being thrown. Come on. If Mazzagatti did that on a UFC show Dana would have him whacked.
I don’t know if I’ve ever seen such apathy on a fighter’s face as Mousasi had tonight. I guess his strategy was wait for Mo to gas out and take over the fight in 4 and 5, but Mo got his second wind in round 3 and kept it for the rest of the fight so it blew up in his face. Although technically Mousasi had every single stat in his favor but the takedowns. But in American judging playing for upkicks is never going to woo the judges.
I don’t know what Strikeforce’s future on CBS is. They’d better pray Gina comes out of exile and the Fedor drama of the week gets settled. It’s still cheap programming on the TV night of the week nobody cares about. But things certainly aren’t looking good. I usually hate the internet MMA drama of the month, but when a bunch of people who hate MMA say it’s a sport filled with thugs and then a guy gets jumped and kicked when he’s down by several people and the promotion REPLAYS IT you’ve got problems in the national spotlight.
CBS’s Kelly Kahl spoke to Sherdog
Will we still see Mousasi in the LHW Top 10? Or, dumber still, will Lawal make his entrance into the rankings? Here’s the sensible list at 205.
1. Machida
2. Evans
3. A. Silva
4. Griffin
5. Rua
6. Jackson
7. Henderson
8. Liddell
9. Franklin
10. W.Silva
11. T.Silva
12. Bader
13. Jardine
14. Ortiz
15. Jones
16. Couture
17. Coleman
18. Soszynski
19. Bonnar
20. Irvin
21. Shafer
22. Alexander
23. Nogueira
24. Lawal
25. Mousasi
26. Sobral
27. Cane
28. Sokoudjou
I’m not saying Lawal needs to be top 10, but come on, Houston Alexander, Stephan Bonnar, James Irvin and Eric Shafer above he and Mousasi? Please explain this since you take your rankings so seriously.
Also Wanderlei isn’t fighting at 205 anymore so he should be removed.
The whole chain of #15-#22 stems from Houston Alexander’s knockout of the then highly ranked Jardine (himself fresh off a knockout of Forrest Griffin.) James Irvin and Eric Shafer then beat Alexander. Stephan Bonnar beat Shafer and lost to Krzysztof Soszynski and Mark Coleman. Randy Couture beat Coleman, as did Jon Jones.
Alexander’s ranking, and the chain above him, is odd indeed, but if you invalidate it, you also undermine the case for Jones as a top-ranked fighter. His greatest career victory is over Bonnar. Even if you were to count the Matt Hamill fight as a win for Jones, Hamill is unranked at LHW (in my books. Who has beaten?) Neither is Brandon Vera, who holds only two wins (against bums) and three losses in the weightclass.
As for Wanderlei Silva, I prefer ranking fighters in all weight classes at which they’ve recently competed, to avoid confusion when back-and-forth class jumping takes place. By recently, I’ve been going by “last three years” but maybe it’s reasonable to cut that down to two. So if Silva is still at middleweight in December, I’ll take him off the 205 list.
Alexanderâs ranking, and the chain above him, is odd indeed, but if you invalidate it, you also undermine the case for Jones as a top-ranked fighter. His greatest career victory is over Bonnar.
So, you keep Alexander to protect Jon Jones having a high ranking? That doesn’t seem very objective.
Alan,
No, I keep Alexander because of the reasoning outlined above (he beat Jardine in a huge upset when Jardine was coming off a win over Griffin). As the Light Heavies underneath him beat fighters ranked above him, they will leapfrog him and he will plummet down the ranks.
I’m just pointing out the consequence of removing Alexander and the chain above him. Those who invalidate Alexander’s ranking inadvertently also undermine Jones’s ranking.
And at Middleweight:
1. A.Silva
2. Belfort
3. Shields
4. Henderson
5. Franklin
6. Sonnen
7. Okami
8. Sakara
9. Leites
10. Marquardt
11. Maia
12. Souza
13. Lindland
14. Lutter
15. Cote
16. Almeida
17. Munoz
18. Grove
19. W. Silva
20. Bisping
21. Akiyama
22. Mousasi
23. J. Miller
24. Lawler
25. Trigg
26. Day
27. Belcher
28. Rivera
29. Quarry
30. Gouveia
31. MacDonald
32. Lombard
33. Starnes
34. Leben
35. Santiago
36. Khalidov
37. Filho
38. Misaki
39. Kang
Lightweight:
1. Edgar
2. Penn
3. Melendez
4. Aoki
5. Cavalcante
6. Alvarez
7. Hansen
8. Sherk
9. Sanchez
10. Florian
11. Sotiropoulos
12. Stevenson
13. Maynard
14. Griffin
15. Huerta
Just my thoughts here.
I actually held off on posting until after the event, but here goes:
I really wanted to see this show succeed, but had some issues with the booking and here is why-
1) Too many 5 round championship fights for 2 hours on network TV.
Just as many have said, if all 3 title fights go five rounds (which they did) CBS affiliates will not be happy.
In addition to the time contraints, which we all knew would be a problem, you’ve given away too many selling points for future shows.
2) No real build up for Dan Henderson-
By this I mean, why not bring Dan in and in his first fight, have him fight a mid-carder and knock him out?
The fans reacted strongly to when Dan knocked down Jake Shields twice in the first round, and U.S. fans, casual fans especially, appreciate the stand-up aspect of MMA more anyway.
In addition, it would have been good for Dan to have a tune up fight before fighting Jake. About seven years or so ago in PRIDE. Dan henderson had a fight, against I beleive Takanori Gomi. During the fight between rounds, Dan told his corner, “I need to fight more”, meaning while he was in shape, he was not in *fighting* shape.
If he was to have knocked someone out in spectacular fashion, then to the casual fans, he comes across as a star,…NOT just from the hype Strikeforce was feeding the fans, but then they have seen for themselves by him taking someones head off.
Now, he has lost in not only his debut, but his shot at the title as well. Where does Strikeforce go with him from here?
3) Shiya Aoki-
Aoki is as good as they say he is,…he really is!
The problem is that while his grappling is phenominal, his stiking sucks. That is as good as they say he is. đ
They knew this going in to this fight.
And getting back to how casual U.S. fans are about fighters who don’t strike…
And like Henderson, why not bring Aoki in, have him tie up some mid-carder in knots, look like a star, and build him up. No one knew who he was, but they expected him to get the star treatment reaction from fans.
Aoki could have then come back later and maybe been a bit more of an attraction (if not actual draw) and been used again. If he would have stunk up the cage in his follow up fight, well at least he could then been used as an “international star” after an exciting submission.
It would have been better to show a mid-card fight or two that would feature more knockouts or submissions.
And yes, they need to allow grounded elbows or forearms, it would ad a great deal of action to ground fights.
I don’t think to CBS is making as big of a deal about the overrun as internet fans are. They had 5 minutes devoted to Mayhem highlights from his can fight and several interviews and video packages they could have cut out to have the fight end earlier. They also could have just ended the show immediately after the decision was read (which would have saved things it turns out.) But they ended it close to midnight because they wanted the overrun rating; it’s the same reason why WWE has made a point to end shows late since 1998.
As for affiliates, they’ll get over it. Fox had a baseball game that went 13 innings that delayed all of their shows. It happens with sporting events. It happens with award shows. Boo hoo, so your news has to air pre-taped an hour later once every 3 months.
The tune-up fight has been dead since Cro Cop-Gonzaga. Let’s say Henderson fought Cung Le or somebody and looked as bad as he did tonight, then you’ve just blown your money match up. It isn’t worth the risk.
I think Aoki would have had problems with practically anybody. He’s very small compared to your average American Lightweight. The same gameplan (use your size to prevent a takedown, pick him apart standing) would have been used by anybody on the planet. Plus he still wouldn’t have cage trained or gone out of his way to tool up his gameplan to deal with American rules (specifically stand ups.) Not taking anything away from Melendez’s win, but Aoki was doomed to lose from the beginning since practically every American Lightweight is a larger wrestler.
I think part of the problem is that Strikeforce doesn’t have the roster depth to put those fights together. They could get some scrub for them to beat up on, but there aren’t any “mid-card fighters” available that would represent a real valid competitive challenge, even kinda-sorta. A “mid-card fighter” has to at least be someone you’ve heard of, not someone who was near the top of a regional card two weeks ago making $500 a fight (not that those shows aren’t entertaining, but their fighters aren’t ready for prime-time TV yet).
Overall it’s been a pretty crappy could months for MMA with one or two bright spots, but with the depth of events we’ve had, that’s not enough. I’m getting kind of tired of this level of mediocrity.
“As for affiliates, theyâll get over it. Fox had a baseball game that went 13 innings that delayed all of their shows. It happens with sporting events. It happens with award shows. Boo hoo, so your news has to air pre-taped an hour later once every 3 months.”
Oh, I agree with you personally. Its just that MMA has a negative stigma about it because the general public doesn’t understand it, including local station programers. Due that that, THIS is why affiliates whine about their newscasts coming on late.
King Mo gave a strong showing. He has more wrestling credibility than most in MMA and, that fact showed greatly in his performance.
Shields started off his fight with me thinking that he wasn’t up there with the big boys in the UFC. Henderson was getting the best of him for a bit with his brawling skills. However, ex-grapplers trying to punch is a myth the UFC likes to promote. Oh, great skills, great punches, blah, blah, blah.
All Shields needed to do was to get out of the stand and, bang mentality and, do what he did best, take down and, grapple. He did a masterful job and,I thought the match was exciting.
It’s truly meaningful on an athletic level when a wrestler and, BJJ grappler win their match with their main talent. That fact needs to be brought up and, pushed to the rafters.
The post fight brawl was, inappropriate, and, preventing it in the future by keeping most people out of a post fight ring is the proper consequence. Maybe only the fighters, ref, announcer, medical people and, security should be the only people allowed in the ring after a fight on national TV.
Perhaps some fines and, suspensions could be enacted for some of the more outrageous escapades, but this is a fighting sport. Don’t go overboard.
I’ve noticed a few people mention Aoki’s lack of spandex pants as one of the reasons for his lack of submissions last night. Aoki could’ve put neoprin sleeves on his ankles and knees and he could’ve worn long biker shorts under his MMA shorts just like Sotiropolous did on UFC 110.
Aoki lost because his striking sucks and because he couldn’t keep Melendez on the floor.
Odd that we didn’t see Aoki with knee wraps and ankle wraps in an effort to replicate the “advantage” that his tights give him. That is assuming his tights actually help him. Since he didn’t play the wrapping game, I’m assuming he either doesn’t think they give him an advantage or they actually don’t. They are spandex, not wool tights from carnival AT shows and frontier catch-wrestling days.
That said, the notion that Aoki didn’t train in a cage prior to this fight is somewhat troubling. I’m pretty sure there is at least one cage (just a couple of pieces of one?) in Japan for him to train in/against. Even though the commentary was terrible on this show, Shamrock did at least speak to the difference between the cage and ropes and how the cage can actually be used both offensively and defensively. I’m not sure if the lack of training in a cage by Aoki was egotistical, stupid, or a combination of the two.
Either way, hopefully fighters looking to move from one fighting environment to another will start to take the differences more seriously. Going either way, from cage to ring or ring to cage could present completely different scenarios, requiring different coaches as well. Don’t even get me started on moving to a no-rope ring surrounded by exploding barb-wire snake pits.
– Battleman!
Ratings are in… And even more bad news for Strikeforce… 2.63 Million viewers. The Fedor/Rogers show did 3.79 for the same overnight rating (ended up doing 4 Million). And viewership was actually going down for the last half hour (not the overun portion).
What I liked about ths show was how it pretty much proved exactly what me and a few others have been saying all along… That the talent just isn’t there outside of the UFC…. And these guys are being ranked too high…
Mousasi has never had a game from his back. This was evident in his fight with Soko. It was only a matter of time before this happened to him. And in the UFC, he would only look worse against guys like Phil Davis, Jon Jones, Rashad Evans, Ryan Bader, and the other good takedown artists.
Aoki and all of his other Japanese Lightweights have been overrated for a while now. This was more proof. He looked horrible in there. The submissions he pulls off in Japan just won’t happen against the strong American Lightweights. Rankings should be showing huge adjustments due to the Melendez/Aoki fight….
Lastly, Strikeforce is screwed. Extremely low ratings. They now have good sized contracts for guys with little value in Henderson & Mousasi. And they will be getting into potential mini-wars with the UFC over talent. Even if they sign them back, the UFC will push up the price just enough to make them hurt. And Fedor is just the final straw…. The issues he brings…. From monetary…. To the time it takes to negotiate… He is another burdon on Strikeforce.
DW was right again by letting Henderson go…..
45 Huddle,
Do you think that this is a good thing though since it will mean the end of Strikeforce MMA….and do you think things would be better if there was no other MMA promotion in North America (excluding really small regional shows) except for the UFC?
Would that make things better?
Organizations like Strikeforce are needed, but not at the level they are trying to do things. There still needs to be local promoters to cultivate talent. But when they get in the way of having some of the best talent fighting each other…. They do more harm then good.
I addressed small local promotions in my question. I was wanting you to agree with the statement that there only needs to be on large promoter putting on high level shows in North America, and that promoter is the UFC. Would you agree with that?
One organization needs to have all the best fighters in it, absolutely. Does that have to be the UFC? If somebody can come along and do it better and make the sport better then the UFC, then I would support them being the main company for the sport.
As of today, the UFC is the only organization that is capable of doing it.
I just find it pointless to see Coker and Shields fighting over if he has a 1 fight option left when everybody knows Shields wants into the UFC…. And most people want to see him in the UFC…. And he is already moving up in weight because Coker is out of opponents for him at his best weight class.
Or even look at Fedor…. If Fedor was in the UFC…. Then we would also get Sylvia, Arlovski, and a few others in the UFC as well. But as long as Fedor is out of the UFC, there is too much risk for Zuffa to promote Arlovski, see him do well, and then have a champion who lost to Fedor.
Many problems are solved by having the best in one company….
45 Huddle,
My Skype name is iloveuco
I am logged on pretty much all the time. Hit me up…I would like to talk to you about some of your ideas.
FTR I only see one problem with all of the talent being in 1 promotion, Pay.
The promtion would have a pricing lock on the whole game. When fighters step up and create a union so they could share in more of the profits from all events, then the UFC would become something like the NFL,NHL, or MLB.
Until this happens more than one promtion is needed to keep the pay for fighters honest.
The american mma rules are stifling the action and therefore, the sport.
We didn’t see ‘American’ mma rules last night – we saw ‘Strikeforce’ rules.
And how bad does DREAM look right now? Their CHAMPIONS are getting beaten up badly against America’s second biggest company….. Are they even left with a credible champion at this point?
Do they have any more champions period haha?
[…] said to be poor. Zach Arnold essentially sounds the death toll for any future events on CBS in his report, noting the show consisted of “75 minutes of largely boring action, combined with […]
The post-fight brawl, which incidentally had more action than all three televised fights and yet they cut away from it, seems to have been the result of Shields and his goons not knowing how to do business. Mayhem is obviously a fan of Pro-Wrestling, and because of that he knows how to draw heat.
If Shields understood this, he would have engaged with Miller verbally to setup their next fight since the organization they work for has no idea how to promote fights. Unfortunately, it came off looking amateurish at best and a complete cluster-f at worst. And yes, the “gentelmen, we’re on national television” just added to the “we don’t know WTF we’re doing here.”
When Brock Lesnar entered the ring after Shane Carwin’s win at UFC 111 I guarantee you it was not a surprise to Shane that Brock was going to cut a promo on him and it was all completely orchestrated by the UFC in order to build interest in their upcoming fight. If Strikeforce knew anything about “promotion” and not just “putting on fights” they would have orchestrated (or at least capitalized on) this post-fight encounter in order to build on their “feud” and Mayhem’s win earlier in the night to both setup their fight and promote a home-grown star since their champ just demolished a UFC “super star”. And having the announcers “in on it” would had them pumping up the next fight between Shields and Miller and not apologizing… you never apologize. C’mon man.
Watching Strikeforce is like watching TNA in its “fight” against WWE. I want there to be another viable US promotion (in both Pro-Wrestling and MMA), but everyone who steps up to challenge the market leader does so in the same way, and ends up failing. WWE is *the best* at what they do and so is UFC; and neither have much to do with what happens between the ropes or inside the cage. I for one think Bellator has the most entertaining and competitive fights right now. And no-one will ever see them (cough *ROH* cough).
Going back to the Strikeforce as TNA analogy for a second… at least in Strikeforce their guys can actually beat up old UFC guys. In TNA they have to put over washed-up WWE guys.
– Battleman!
Just now reading Scott Coker’s reaction to Mayhem’s entering the cage on his own “None of my staff brought him in there.” – exactly, Mr. Coker… exactly. Go back to San Jose and “put on fights”…
And how about Frank Shamrock going into business for himself and telling everyone how much he doesn’t like Jake Shields and how bad he wants to fight him. And Gus Johnson and Mauro went along with it. Talking about how Shamrock walked out of the fighter interview with Jake Shields and how that’s ‘a true sign of disrespect’. Then Shamrock says BEFORE the main event, after two lackluster/boring fights already that the reason he doesn’t like Shields is because he’s boring and does just enough to win.
I swear that whole company must either be incompetent or sit around and hit the crack pipe before they go on air. Absolutely nuts.
It’s EliteXC 2.0…
I think there is no question that Strikeforce is gone from CBS now. Bad ratings, including bad in the key dempographic… Lot’s of issues for CBS like the Fedor issues and having to potentially move the date for UFC putting a show against them…. The boring fights and extra fight at the end was easily the final straw….
Which leaves Strikeforce with Showtime, which gives it a viewing audience of 500,000 for their big shows tops. I highly doubt they will be able to afford Fedor wasn;t CBS chipping in for the bill. And I can’t imagine that new contract that Mousasi has was that cheap. Plus Henderson…. I actually thought they were going to stick to Showtime…. But I could see going out of business potential with the way they have things set up.
Which leaves Bellator with their one shot to get the Showtime position. But what a clusterf#ck for Showtime to go through organizations like that. Always featuring different championship belts…. Comical it really is.
Coker proved he is clueless on the national stage.
Frank Shamrock at least recognizes that he needs to go into business for himself to stay relevant. And since he has a huge fan in Mauro, the Frank-as-legend echo chamber just continues to resonate. Gus has no idea what is going on, so it continues.
Everyone hates on WWE and McMahon for sitting in the back screaming in his announcers’ ears to stay on the story line but he understands the reasons why that must be. Maybe there is a middle ground between Vince’s iron fist and the complete lack of control shown by Strikeforce?
UFC announcers occasionally stray (sometimes wildly), but they continually get reigned-in when Goldberg has to promote (there’s that word again, huh?) either a sponsor or an upcoming event. And even when a fighter is being used on UFC telecasts for color commentary they don’t go into business for themselves; likely because they have pre-built story lines that they are following and don’t need to.
The more I think about it and look back, the more obvious it is that Strikeforce is really just a bunch of fights assembled together in one place occasionally and everything else is loosely-coupled, at best. The announcing is a bolt-on, the “promotion” (whatever that is) is a bolt-on, etc. There is not a cohesive unit working toward the same goal like you have with the UFC. As has been noted by Zach and elsewhere, its likely due to the fact that Strikeforce and its other “promotional” partners (CBS, Showtime, etc.) are *not* a cohesive unit with the same goals.
– Battleman!
Battleman, if the announcers are going to be truly neutral (which isn’t going to happen because they are always trying to do something. They need to get professional broadcasters and analysts who won’t be looking to look out for themselves first.
In the bigger sports, analysis by people who are looking for their next coaching job or when they put on current players for the playoffs is usually useless, why anyone thinks Frank Shamrock can be unbiased or stick to the company’s story lines when he’s actively fighting is insane.
Your comparison of UFC/Strikeforce/Bellator with WWE/TNA/ROH is spot on.
The UFC has set the standard for how MMA looks in the U.S. That’s the bottom line, imo.
If Strikeforce could have had a Ward-Gatti type fight last night, maybe that could have started something. But as Alan wrote, MMA isn’t likely to have too many of those, if any at all.
MMA isn’t booming in the U.S. The UFC is.
@Fluyid – Well said: “MMA isnât booming in the U.S. The UFC is.”
Like I said, I would love for a viable alternative to the UFC in the US, but not because I hate the UFC; I really like their product, production values, and many of their fighters. I just think that competition makes things better (rising tide lifting boats, etc.).
But it is critical to know if the market you’r jumping into is growing/booming/etc. as a whole or if one organization is popular above and beyond the market/sport/whatever itself. UFC is popular; clearly MMA outside of the UFC is not. NFL is popular, clearly pro-football on its own is not. WWE is (was?) popular but Pro-Wrestling beyond the WWE is not.
If someone is looking to enter those markets – MMA: Strikeforce, EliteXC, Affliction, etc., Football: UFL, XFL, etc. or Wrestling: WCW, TNA etc. – they need to realize why the market leader is the market leader and either compete on their level against their same market position or find a different angle to attack.
ROH does this in Pro-Wrestling… and gets ~700 people to buy their PPV.
Arena Football does this and until 1.5 years ago was doing okay. They’re back this season and we’ll have to see. I think it works for them because hardcore NFL fans don’t consider it real football and therefore don’t consider it competition. They have a cross-over and also different fanbase.
Bellator is attempting this in MMA with the tournament-style seasons. I think this provides a completely different experience than the UFC and they are going into the market with a different strategy. We’ll see if it works, but at least they recognize there needs to be a differentiator from the UFC and that for MMA to work it still needs to be focused on 1-on-1 competition (unlike IFL)… unless we’re talking about tag-team MMA… ZST FTW!
– Battleman
The post-fight brawl was a blessing in disguise. They need to get Shields and setup a rematch. Strikeforce’s marketing department needs to jump all over this and spin it while they can.
20,000+ hits on YouTube already… this is viral.
“Strikeforceâs marketing department”
They have a marketing department?
[…] and the behavioral failure, and Zach Arnold, who points out that not only was the card boring, but it completely bombed in terms of ratings. It’s hard to see CBS being excited about another Strikeforce […]
Main page of yahoo.ca, this is the TOP story:
“Ugly brawl mars Jake Shields’ win, embarrasses MMA”
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/mma/blog/cagewriter/post/Ugly-brawl-mars-Jake-Shields-win-embarrasses-M?urn=mma,234891
hopefully shields moves on to the UFC and goes back to 170lbs. Then we can get some movement in that division, ie Shields vs Alves, or Fitch, etc.
Strikeforce certianly faces an uphill battle from here. I think 45 is correct, it needs to operate on a smaller and regional level. We will see though what happens.
I had high hopes this card. But a —-fest is a good way of describing it. Mousasi and Lawal looked shite. Mousasi is still young and can improve, he might be moving to LA which only can help.
The Mayhem incident wont sink Strikeforce, but the ratings could. Oh well, competiton is always better but it looks like no-one can really step up to the plate at the moment.
just saying that there is actually a difference with LHW and LW which is treated as the same in the article đ
I think MMA *could* easily support a second national promotion.
It just that Strikeforce seems to lack direction.
Well, they know were they want to go (so maybe they don’t lack direction) they just don’t know how to get there.
But even if they become “#2 MAJOR promotion for MMA”, they need to do things on a slower scale,…as well as a smaller scale.
It can be done. Remember, when Dana White convinced ZUFFA to take over UFC, they had a few very rough years. They were NOT an instant success. They almost didn’t make it. Anyone remember that Dana was even more outspoken then he is now? It was most deffinatly due to the pressure he was under then.
Not only did they stick with it (UFC) but they had a game plan and obviously had the staff they needed, they had a marketing department,…does Strikeforce even have an actual marketing department?
Anyway, someone can make a second promotion work,…they just need to know how to do it.
I don’t know how SF is going to afford Fedor if they’re only on Showtime.  Unless they let DREAM pick up the tab for him and just air Fedor fights in Japan under the SF banner on Showtime.Â
Am I the only one surprised that Mayhem Miller is getting most of the heat for the brawl than the Diaz thugs, Melendez and Shields?
Miller interrupted an interview – fine. Bad timing and a tad rude.
But for a GANG ASSAULT to ensue, which involved numerous people attacking Miller and kicking him while he’s down?!
And for Scott Coker to be pinning the blame almost exclusively on Miller for the entire incident?!
Good lord…what if one of those soccer kicks had caused a serious injury, or worse? Miller has the right to press charges for assault, no question. Not that I’m saying he would, or should, but he definitely has the right.
If he HAD suffered a major injury, I don’t think we’d be hearing this type of garbage from Coker – a man whom at one point I admired for his desire to compete with the UFC, but I now see as a lowlife dirtbag who’s willing to throw one of his athletes (and a legitimate assault victim) under the bus to protect a more valuable asset to his company.
This whole thing is pretty disgusting.
Well, it was 3 of his champions. And his fault everyone was in there. Easier to blame Mayhem.
Coker has no choice but to take the side of his champions. If he took the moral side, he would have nobody left to fight in his organization for 6 months…
Nick Diaz is a thug. He has had multiple issues in the past with behavior like that.
Melendez is a sort of thug. Can come off more clean, but when push comes to shove he is a thug.
Dana White was right when he bashed what happened. This wouldn’t happen in the UFC because Miller would have never been allowed in and none of Shields teammates would have been with him.
Nobody cares to see all of a fighters friends in the octagon with them after a fight. It looks trashy just like it does in boxing.
This is just another example of Coker not knowing how to operate on the big stage.
Sorry, but the commission controls who can enter the cage after fights. The promotion has zero to do with it.
Mayhem was in Henderson’s corner. He would have been in the UFC cage after the fight under the same circumstances.
Trust me, the UFC has ZERO to do with that. I speak from personal experience with the UFC in three different states.
Then tell me this…
1) How come a UFC event has a vastly smaller number of cornermen for each fighter compared to a Strikeforce fighter?
2) How come a Affliction, EliteXC, or Strikeforce ring/cage was filled after the main events but for a UFC main event the cage is barely populated?
Are you telling me the UFC has no say in these things? And somehow the commissions selectively allow more fighters into the post fight celebrations for non-UFC events? They obviously do. You can see it plain as day on the telecasts.
The UFC has 100% control over this, I don’t care what the “rules” the commissions have….
Clearly, some of Team Cesar Gracie’s trashiness comes from Cesar Gracie himself, based on the quotes in this article: http://mmajunkie.com/news/18789/cesar-gracie-says-reaction-to-strikeforce-nashville-brawl-is-overblown-hypocritical.mma
Remember, Cesar Gracie is also the same guy who said that he had a “secret deal” in place with former CSAC director Armando Garcia so that Nick Diaz would still be able to use his marijuana. Cesar Gracie is also the same guy who said that he had a deal in place with Armando Garcia to keep his own positive drug test for marijuana a secret (as in, Cesar Gracie’s positive test when he fought Frank Shamrock). There’s a long history of shady behavior.
Dana White missed a HUGE opportunity by not suspending Nate Diaz.
If I was Dana White, I would suspend Nate Diaz for 6 months.
That would put so much pressure on Coker to suspend all 3 of his champions, including Nate Diaz, Jake Shields, and Gilbert Melendez. If he did suspend them, he would have no main events past May. If he didn’t, he would look beyond weak and this would haunt him in the media for a long time…
That’s actually a clever strategy.
Nick and Nate Diaz are talented and entertaining – but they’re both absolute poison for MMA (and mentally unbalanced).
It’s only a matter of time before one of the Diaz brothers – in or out of the ring – does something even more completely insane.
Would anyone really be surprised if you heard one of them was at a beach party and stabbed someone with a butterfly knife? Or got high and ran over a kid at a crosswalk?
With these maniacs I get the impression it’s only a matter of time…
Right, because looking “weak” to online fans makes a bit of difference into the financial sustainability of the promotion. Would any fan who had originally intended to attend the show/watch at home actually boycott a show headlined by guys who “should be” suspended according to Lord Dana, aside from you? I doubt it.
It becomes a good talking point. Everytime he is asked about Strikeforce, he can bring it up and continue to hurt them. Public perception can be cruel.
And Nate Diaz is the perfect pawn. Enough of a name to have an impact but not enough to effect the UFC’s business.
Seriously, though, the media could give two shits about Strikeforce as it is. Why draw any attention to them at all? MMA is and will continue to be considered a freak show by the general public that’s just a notch above pro-wrestling on the respectability scale, despite the prurient wishes of its supporters for it to take on the major sports leagues. If anything, this might draw some notoriety/eyeballs that could potentially increase ratings for the next show on CBS (if there IS a next Strikeforce event on network television, of which I’m doubtful).
45, you should be in PR…I like this angle. If Dana were smart he’s run with it.
When MMA is desperately trying to find legitimacy as a ‘real sport’, Dana can point out that Strikeforce, with their thugs, are undoing his hard work (which is true).
As a Toronto-based fan, I would love nothing more than for MMA to be sanctioned in Ontario, but the Diaz bothers and their crazy bullcrap do nothing to help the situation.
“Are you telling me the UFC has no say in these things? And somehow the commissions selectively allow more fighters into the post fight celebrations for non-UFC events? They obviously do. You can see it plain as day on the telecasts.
The UFC has 100% control over this, I donât care what the ârulesâ the commissions have⌔
Settle down there, couch potato. I have personally been in the UFC cage after a fight when there were the 2 fighters, the ref, 3 cornermen from both teams, the announcer, 4 Nevada commission members, all of the UFC TV camera guys, Joe Rogan, Joe Silva and one additional fighter who had absolutely nothing to do with the fight that had just taken place.
Yes, I’m telling you that the UFC has nothing to do with it. That fenced in area around the cage is called the technical zone, and the commission runs it.
“The UFC has 100% control over this”
You literally know nothing about this stuff.
The only influence that you could say that the UFC has is that people tend to conduct themselves better, both in the back and in the technical area, due to the UFC course of conduct which leads everyone to walk around on eggshells in fear of being cut. And so, in an indirect way, the UFC is definitely influencing this. Just not in the way that you, sitting home in front of your TV, have surmised.
LOL
Greatest. Post. Ever.
Ha……(long pause)…..HAAA.
Then explain to me how 20 people from team Gracie can be in the Strikeforce cage after the fight… And that has never happened in a UFC fight?
Because they conduct themselves better?
The night before, ESPN2 ran a show from Memphis, Tennessee. During the main event bout of Tony Thompson/Owen Beck, Tony Atlas went off on a tangent about how many people were in the ring that were unnecessary; friends of promoters, commission people, random folk. He was wondering why the commission would allow such a thing, and also noted that Tennessee was one of the few states who would allow Owen Beck to fight due to eye issues.
Therein lies your answer.
CORRECTED VERSION
I agree that ranking the Japanese fighters high is usually wrong. Aoki would get his @$$ handed to him by Penn and some others. I agree that Edgar, Penn, Florian and Maynard are all among the top 5. BUT Melendez isn’t. Diego Sanchez would tear him a new anal orifice as would Sean Sherk. Melendez won a split decision over Guida when Guida wasn’t as good as he is now and Guida beat Josh Thompson against whom Melendez is 1-1. I don’t think Melendez could handle a any of the others nor could even he hang with Jose Aldo or Uriah Faber.
An aside re A. Silva: Most commentary about him I hear lately makes me think people are losing their minds. He just gets started on Patrick Cote who did absolutely nothing to hurt Silva in their brief âmatchâ then twists his knee and decides he canât continue. This is Silvaâs fault?! Thales Leites, who, as he aptly demonstrated, had no business being in the same cage as Silva*, continually throws himself on the floor to avoid getting his lights punched out. This may have been a very smart thing to do if he werenât paid to actually fight Silva. But his cowardice is somehow again, Silvaâs fault?! I guess in a way it is. Maybe Dana should ask him to stop being so intimidating. Then Silva, after getting booed(!) annihilates Forrest Griffin, a good but not great and super-hyped fighter from the LH division(!) Everyone is pleased again. Then the Belfort fight doesnât happen âcause the Phenom is injured. Again, this is Silvaâs fault?! So, White forces Silva to fight the obviously over-matched Maia instead. Silva steps up and positively embarrasses Damien who looked like he didnât know wtf a fight is. Then, in the middle of the âfightâ, Silva wisely decides to forego taking any risks and invites Maia to step up and try to take some shots at him. Maia refuses. Silva dances his way to a decision; a majority decision instead of a unanimous decision because some douche-bag somehow decided that Silvaâs transmogrification of Maia into a human punching bag was a âtieâ. To add insult to injury, Dan the Dork Mirgliotta (how I wish he and Mazzagatti werenât Italian-American) yells at Silva âcause heâs not fighting; never mind what Maia wasnât doing and never mind that this is unprecedented in the UFC. Silva should have dropped him but Andersonâs too smart for that. Finally, Dana decides Silva is the douche-bag and behaves as though heâs ready to fire him. My advice: if he wants to lose the best fighter in the world. Hand him over to another org., alienate millions of fans and ruin the UFC, go right ahead then. How about letting Silva have some real competition for a change? I would love to see Dana do something besides tweet and get Silva matches with Jake Shields, Belfort ,Wanderlei, Mousassi and Chael Sonnen after he and (Marquardt rematch). Then maybe he can work on getting Melendez, Nick Diaz, Fedor, Rogers, Overeem and Orlovski into or back into the UFC so they can get their respective butts kicked (except maybe Fedor who may take the HW title).
*Leites was handed a win over the clearly superior Nate Marquardt because one of the aforementioned douchebag refs docked him 2 points during the fight for virtually no reason. Then Leites was dropped by the struggling but improving Legionarius and then promptly dumped by the UFC.