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Elite XC 2/10 Southaven, MS
By Zach Arnold | February 10, 2007
This is the open post for everyone who is watching tonight’s event. ProElite.com will be airing their undercard fights (starting at 7 PM EST) on their web site, but the catch is that you have to sign up for an account first. The main card will air on Showtime in America and The Fight Network in Canada. The Miami Herald previews the event.
Any and all thoughts on the fights and fallout from the event goes here.
Fallout
- The Canadian Press (via The Brandon Sun Online): Gracie beats Shamrock by DQ on first Elite XC MMA card
- The Houston Chronicle: DQ leads to Gracie’s MMA win
- The Memphis Commercial Appeal: Think women don’t belong in MMA? Tough. Carano scores decision in first for cable
- MMA on Tap: Elite XC: Destiny thoughts
- CBS Sportsline: Shamrock DQ’d for illegal strikes against Gracie
- MMA Ring Report: Elite XC results & photos
- Fight Report: Renzo Gracie wins by DQ!
- Radio: Eddie Goldman reviews Elite XC event
- Josh Gross: Controversial end greets Showtime’s MMA debut
- Doghouse Boxing: Elite XC: Main event controversy, card a success
- MMA Insider: Elite XC Event pics from press row
- UGO: Elite XC Fight Impressions
- 15 Rounds: Elite XC on Showtime vs. Boxing on HBO
- The Houston Chronicle: Elite XC debut lacked big-league punch (‘it was easily the quietest MMA show I’ve ever attended’)
Topics: All Topics, Media, MMA, Pro Elite, Zach Arnold | 190 Comments » | Permalink | Trackback |
I think Frank also revealed the true nature of his feud with Dana White/Zuffa. He wouldn’t even make the middle of the pack in UFC’s 185 lb division.
I just found out what a server stalling and almost crashing is like.
Let’s do this again for the next big MMA show. Give the server some more headaches.
Even if Frank got paid a million per fight, Dana would have forced him to fight certain guys. And that would have quickly been the death of his career. Say what you want about the UFC, but their top talent is forced to fight top guys on a regular basis. Yes, they might have an easier fight here or there, but eventually you have to prove yourself, and that is a tough thing for a fighter like Frank to do.
I am so happy he finally came back. Another “mystique” is finally crushed. I can’t stand when people act as if a fighter is unbeatable. Especially a guy like Frank Shamrock, who has ducked top competition for 5+ years.
It’s times like this that I really appreciate Fight Opinion. Honestly and truly.
I am amazed and thoroughly dissapointed at people’s attitudes to what happened.
If Frank Shamrock really did study the human anatomy as much as he claims he did, he would be aware that neck and back of the head injuries can get very serious with only a little bit of impact, especially at a weird angle.
A guy with his intellect should be able to follow rules. He’s a samrt guy, i am sure he can read. Something is visibly wrong with Renzo, and if frank says that he is acting, i believe that he is saying that to cover up his own dissapointment with his performance and his ability to behave professionally.
This isnt a good look for Showtime as far as appearing to be legit and credible for their first promotion. This type of behavior is more like HBO Boxing.
Frank was losing, broke the rules, and was disqualified. There is no controversy as far as Herb Dean’s decision. The commisioner told him, if the attack was intentional, it was a DQ, and its pretty clear that it was.
For all the people responding in a negative manner to Dean and Gracie, i think you should seriously re-consider what was right and what was wrong here.
So, looking forward….
Strikeforce & Showtime are supposed to be co-promoting a PPV with Shamrock vs. Baroni. How does that sell on PPV? I can’t imagine more then 50,000 PPV buys, and that is being generous.
oh and Tomer Chen, i appreciated the golota reference…
Which is why, I suspect, you won’t see that as a prevailing attitude around here.
Sherdog… well, that’s another story.
If Fritzie Zivic was still alive, he could have made a vignette with Frank Shamrock teaching him the ‘right’ way of fouling and not getting caught.
One thing this will test is Showtime’s devotion to MMA. With possible bad ticket sales and a real fiasco at the end of their first event, you have to wonder what the executives are thinking.
If you combine that with a first PPV with horrible buy rates…. And it is a receipt for Showtime either pulling out, downgrading (money), or getting very worried about their new project.
More red meat from Sherdog. So much, it’s hard for me to keep up.
Everything was going fine until sleezy Shamrock had to try to cheat to win. Way 2 go Mr. Shamrock *clap clap*. Its a sad day when Bill Goldberg of all people (not a bad commentator by the way ) is tryin to cover his ass by sayin “Thats Frank bein Frank” as Shamrock just tries to laugh it all off.
“Which is why, I suspect, you won’t see that as a prevailing attitude around here.
Sherdog… well, that’s another story.”
Well Zach, at least Eddie Goldman will agree with me, i’m sure. sigh…
Shamrock/Yvel in ’07!
oh yeah, i do need to give Mauro props… I’ve been critical of his commentating abilities in the past, but he sounded much improved tonight.
Darren, I think you’re misunderstanding what Zach said.
Don’t forget ‘Dirty’ Bob Schrijber as the special ref!
Where was Mario Lopez by the way?
I heard he got into a spat before the show aired.
Thanks CapnHulk, yeah I know what he’s saying, i was just being silly.
I felt like I was watching a foul in an Italian soccer game!
Yes, Shamrock did foul Gracie with the knees to the head (intentional or not), but those were some VERY mild shots – not nearly worth the hilarious theatrics that ensued.
Renzo Gracie just made a mocerky of himself – this is the guy who brags that after dislocating his shoulder vs. Sakuraba he felt nothing, and wanted to continue ? PLEASE.
After scoring some nice takedowns (but eating some crisp shots coming in) Renzo was clearly running out of gas, laying and praying…and obviously did not want to risk continuing the fight when he knew he could walk out with a DQ win.
Renzo’s little performance was an embarrassment to the sport of MMA. Leave that type of bullshit to Cristiano Ronaldo, and next time come ready to fight.
The fact that he didn’t flinch with a broken arm should perhaps tell you how serious his actual injury was.
So, how about Big Perm and Krazy Horse?
Red meat alert from The Underground Forum:
Honestly the best fight of the night was between the two chicks. Gina Carano is fucking hot and has some decent striking.
Krazy Horse hits like a train. He was incredibly conceited in defeat though, so I don’t think he made too many fans, but on the other hand doing flips off the cage and having dynamite in his right hand certainly counteract being a dick.
Antonio Silva looked awesome, and totally tooled Cabbage.
Villasenor threw Loiseau around like a rag doll, and I think he is ready for another shot at the UFC.
Frank Shamrock could be the cockiest guy on the planet. He hasn’t had a fight of consequence since 1999, yet he claims that he is the greatest fighter ever. Please. The idiot fans were cheering Frank and booing Renzo, even though the latter represents lots of good things about mma while the former is just a cocky prick who talks more than he fights.
Renzo won the first round clearly, though he didn’t do any damage. Frank got side mounted multiple times, but was never in any danger and did more damage from the bottom than Renzo did from the top, as Gracie landed about 1 punch the entire fucking fight standing or on the ground.
I think Frank may have won had the knee not happened, because Renzo couldn’t do any damage to Frank on the ground, and at 40 years old and flabby, I think Shamrock’s cardio and striking would have eventually taken their toll.
Mauro Ranallo is terrible. Goldberg was clearly uncomfortable with all the pro wrestling references that Ranallo was making about him, and with good reason. If I were Gary Shaw I would keep Ranallo as far away from mma as possible, because his constant talk of how Goldberg beat Hulk Hogan and how Goldberg was a great wrestler (to which Goldberg pointed out rightly that the wrestling he did was fake) only serves to make mma seem to have more in common with pro wrestling than with boxing, which is not what we want. For the love of God why don’t they sign Quadros?? Goldberg and Glazer were ok, but Ranallo has to go.
Surely, a fighter at Renzo’s age could never, ever get hurt… he’s just Superman, that’s all.
Showtime MMa (Pro Elite) didn’t even make a blimp in the radar of MMA.
Want proof?
I just searched “Frank Shamrock” on both YouTube & Daily Motion. I also did a few other searches. I basically got nothing on it. the key demographic of this sport is 18-34, which are the same people who post that stuff online. The fact that I still can’t find a thing, especially after a fiasco ending like that, makes it seem like most people outside of us hardcore fans either didn’t know about the event, or didn’t care about it.
I wonder what the tv ratings are for Elite XC tonight going against boxing on HBO. I know HBO has a much larger audience, so if the numbers are close, that has to be a boost for the viability of mma on Showtime, no?
http://www.technorati.com/search/%22frank+shamrock%22
Keep your eyes open on this link. This is a much better gauge for casual MMA fan reaction. If the show was watched, you’ll see plenty of MySpace journals written about the DQ finish.
Ultimo, i see what you are saying, but sometimes it only takes a little bit of pressure in the wrong are of the neck to really do a lot of damage. I have a good friend who suffered what appeared to be a minor injury wrestling that had long term implications.
You also have to remember, Showtime has to protect their reputation- MMA has a lot of enemies in the sports and sports media world, and they have to make sure others dont perceive them as being negligent on such a big stage.
I’ve seen lots of Renzo’s fights, and i havent seen anything in his past performances that would lead me to believe that he was faking.
I think the embarrasment here was Frank Shamrock being irresponsible as a professional athelete. The way he acted afterwords, hey, he was just trying to do a heel thing, and thats fine, but he should be mad at himself.
I agree, the drama afterwards was excessive. But that dosent really change the fact that Shamrock didnt follow the rules.
I don’t think the ever offically announced that it was Renzo’s decision to stop fighting, did they? Correct if i am wrong, i might be.
Screw Big Perm and Krazy Horse, how about that dragon?
Zach,
The vast majority of those results are from MMA Websites, such as Evil Master (who is a video god), and others like this. Almost no talk by people on their own myspace accounts. I did see one, and the kid said he didn’t even have Showtime.
“Screw Big Perm and Krazy Horse”
Watch your fucking mouth.
” how about that dragon? ”
Still not enough dragon.
Critic – the purpose of the Tech. link is to look at tomorrow. By tomorrow, you’ll get a good idea as to how broad of a scope the audience that was watching the event. You’ll either see next to nothing, or you’ll see a lot of MySpace/LJ entries from marks.
Zach and Darren,
I appreciate what you’re saying, but IMO, it looked like those strikes were not nearly damaging enough to warrant Renzo putting on that silly performance, and ultimately walk away from a main-event fight.
Of course ANYTHING is possible, and if two short knee strikes from the bottom – which appeared to glance off Renzo’s trapezius muscle – were enough to somehow cause a massive, career-threatening head trauma…then I guess I was wrong.
Everyone takes head/neck trauma differently. In the NFL Pro Bowl game today, a punter (Brian Moorman) took a hellacious hit that probably had the same impact as a car accident, and he got right up. But other players get ‘minor’ hits and they suffer stingers all the time. I suspect that’s what happened to Renzo here. Age is certainly a factor with both guys in the main event.
Of course, others may disagree with me.
The knees looked pretty nasty to me. I’m not a huge Gracie fan but Renzo gets respect … this is the same guy who didn’t quit when Sakuraba broke his arm backwards. All in all, if Shamrock hadn’t thrown the illegal knees none of this would even be debated.
I would watch another Elite XC event. I mean, the under card was good, and while the main event had controversy, it still IMO, leads up to a rematch that I would watch if it happened on Showtime again. I wouldn’t pay to see Gracie-Shamrock as a PPV, but IMO, it would make for a good return match on Showtime.
Granted, it’s probably tough to gauge what Showtime ratings are, because where I live, I’m only one of two people I know that has a subscription to Showtime. It’s not like how UFC puts shows on Spike TV, and IMO, as a fan, that should be considered when the numbers are finally published.
“I’d rather pay $9.99 to see Elite then subscribe to Showtime just to catch their debut show.”
That doesn’t make any sense. Showtime is about $10 a month. You’d be more willing to pay if you got less for your money?
The MMA Critic Says:
February 10th, 2007 at 9:23 pm
Jordan,
I have already seen more than 1 fan blaming the UFC for Frank’s loss. Too funny!!
—————–
I was waiting for somebody to suggest Dana had something to do with it.
@Zack “That doesn’t make any sense. Showtime is about $10 a month. You’d be more willing to pay if you got less for your money?”
Thanks for the financial advice. However, it is $12.99 per month to add Showtime to my Dish Network package, but that doesn’t matter. I don’t want to mess with my programming just to catch someone’s debut show. That DOES make sense. Also, are they running every month? If not, and since I have no interest in Showtime programming, why would I add that to my programming package? Even if they are running monthly, I’m not interested in adding Showtime.
MMA Critic: You’re coming off as some paranoid UFC press secretary with these comments. Take it easy!
That finish could easily have LED to a train wreck, but they handled it magnificently, with plenty of replays, taking their time, sticking a mic in with Herb talking with the commisioner dude and agreeing on a decision, announcers explaining in detail why it would be unreasonable to seriously think Renzo was faking, showing concern about the fighter, not trying to cover up or sensationalize anything, and so freaking on. By the time the show went off the air all my disappointment was already gone, and the fight did go into the second round before this happened – it’s not like viewers got ripped off with an eye injury after ten seconds.
Ranallo was better than with Trigg, simply because Glazer and Billberg are less frantic than Trigg, but he still talked too much and had his trademarked endless paragraphs when trying to close something off.
Someone somewhere said earlier in the week that Carano and Kedzie would steal the show, and looking at the reactions from the crowd, nothing beat that fight all night. It was he same deal as the bodogFIGHT PPV, only more competitive. Love it.
Funny to hear Glazer ask Silva what he wants to do next to continue climbing in the ranks, when the guy has been THE dominant SHW for the past couple of years.
I want more of this.