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Would changing major UFC non-title fights from 3 to 5 rounds eliminate the need for interim titles?
By Zach Arnold | June 8, 2010
From Sunday’s Observer radio show, here’s the setup question for the topic:
“This person says I read on the web site today on the Inside MMA report where the panel talked about the possibility of UFC main events being turned into five round fights instead of three rounders regardless whether a title is on the line. I feel there are too many variables for this to be a good solution. For example, if a main event is canceled the last minute because of injury and another match is moved up to the main event, the fighters who would have trained for a three round fight would in theory be forced to fight for five rounds. Or, actually I can add to that, a guy who really haven’t been training at all would have to go from zero round sto five rounds which would be rounds. He says furthermore, with the chances of fighters who are not used to five round fights could gas quickly. A boring or bad three round fight could be an excruciatingly terrible fight if we were forced to watch two more rounds. I’m thinking specifically of lay ‘n pray battles. Do you really think the positives outweigh the negatives when it comes to change three round fights to five rounders?”
And the response in full-page mode…
DAVE MELTZER: “It depends on the situation. I think that as, I think that the idea of making a main event or maybe even limiting it to if you have a title elimination like say that Rampage (Jackson) and Rashad (Evans) fight, which we knew that the winner was going to get a championship match and you have that stipulation built in and make that a five round fight, I don’t think that’s so bad because the fact is that those guys are going to have to fight a five round fight for the championship anyways and if someone gets hurt then maybe you move it down to a three round fight because it’s not a longer title elimination. I think that you know there are times where you know I mean I just remember like with Dan Henderson and Rich Franklin when they had their fight… it was like it was the main event and when it was over you know like the idea of UFC in a lot of ways is that you know yeah you get a winner and a loser but you want a sense of something and I just remember watching that fight, you know and there’s others but that one really was kind of like, well time just ran out. It wasn’t like anyone beat anyone, time just ran out and he was ahead of the race at that specific moment. Which I mean could have also happened in a five round fight but it made you want more because it didn’t feel like it was finality. So, I think that if it’s a main event title elimination fight when you don’t have a championship fight I don’t think that there’s anything wrong with a five round fight. If you got someone who is going to come in late as a late sub, yeah, then I think that you would want to go to three because it is unfair for you know to throw that on a guy who’s been training for a three round (fight).”
BRYAN ALVAREZ: “Yeah, if you’re planning, if it would have been Quinton vs. Rashad and they’d schedule it for five rounds and Quinton pulled out two weeks before, I mean it doesn’t mean you have to have his replacement do a five rounder.”
DAVE MELTZER: “And then I would have the replacement go three and that’s happened before when you have you know if the champion pulls out, let’s just say. Like… if you remember when Matt Serra got injured and they put Georges St. Pierre against Matt Hughes, the reason they created that interim title was an excuse for them to go five rounds because Matt Hughes figured Georges isn’t going to be in shape if we go, I got the edge. It was Matt Hughes’ you know crafty planning which ended up being immaterial because he didn’t go three but that was his mentality and that’s why let’s make it an interim championship because that’s the only way to do. But if not, what would have happened was with Serra out, Matt Hughes and Georges St. Pierre would have been a three round fight and I think that’s what it would have been and I think that’s fine if you have a situation where you know if the guy just goes like, ‘Look, you know, I’m in not shape for a five round fight’ and in that sense if you got three weeks notice or two weeks notice, yeah, make it a three, switch it from five to three, that’s fine. But if it’s two guys and no one’s getting hurt and you know like the Quinton Jackson/Rashad Evans fight… it probably would have been I think, you know it may have been boring for two more rounds but I think in another sense I think five rounds of that fight would have been superior to three because someone probably would have gassed out and then when that person gassed out whoever it would have been you’d at least feel like there was even a more clear-cut winner, you know not that the win wasn’t fairly clear-cut anyways. You might have a finish.”
BRYAN ALVAREZ: “Even if it wasn’t a title runoff or anything like that, I think when you’ve got a fight where you built it up for 13 weeks on Ultimate Fighter and the guys have done great promos on each other, you did the you know the UFC 24/7 or whatever, the Primetime deal, I mean when you put all of that work into putting the fight together, I mean to me the fight’s got to be five rounds. I mean, I don’t think…”
DAVE MELTZER: “It doesn’t have to be but I would think that it’s better if it is.”
BRYAN ALVAREZ: “I say it kind of has to be because you’ve just… to me, I mean it’s not…”
DAVE MELTZER: “Well it doesn’t have to be because people aren’t educated to it, so no one… there wasn’t really anyone complaining at the end going, God, I wish you know it went fight.”
BRYAN ALVAREZ: “I don’t think complaining in the sense that…”
DAVE MELTZER: “You know, but I think it would be better. You know it’s the main event.”
BRYAN ALVAREZ: “I don’t think in the complaining in the sense that they said they never buy a show again like people do when they’re upset with Anderson Silva, but I think that anybody that watched that fight after investing so much time in it for so long, when it ended after 15 minutes they felt that, huh, it would have been cool for this to be five rounds.”
DAVE MELTZER: “I think so, especially as big of a fight as it was.”
BRYAN ALVAREZ: “Yeah, I mean it’s almost like you know these people… it just seems… I don’t think anybody’s going to be clamoring for Rich Franklin and Chuck Liddell to go five rounds, I don’t think you need to do it for every fight, but certain fights are big enough…”
DAVE MELTZER: “You know what though? To me, I think… if it’s the PPV main event, OK, the PPV main event then it should go five rounds because isn’t that what being a main eventer is?”
BRYAN ALVAREZ: “Well, yeah.”
DAVE MELTZER: “You know, I mean, granted like Rich Franklin/Chuck Liddell… probably someone’s getting knocked out before the third round, any way, but if they’re not… you know, they’re in the main event.”
BRYAN ALVAREZ: “Yeah.”
DAVE MELTZER: “You know, that’s what you get you know you make more money when you’re in the main event, you get more prestige when you’re in the main event and then maybe you should go five rounds when you’re in the main event because that’s part of being a main eventer, you know, it makes you different from everyone on the undercard. I think, you know, and again, not on (UFC) Fight Night (on Spike TV), you know not on you know not on Versus main event, but I think PPV main event… yeah, I would say that you should, if you don’t have a championship match, I would like to see the PPV main event go five rounds just because it makes the main event.”
Topics: Media, MMA, UFC, Zach Arnold | 7 Comments » | Permalink | Trackback |
No, people are still suckers for a “title fight” hype job, regardless if they made 5 round non-title fights in their place or not. It has nothing to do with seeing a 25 minute fight, people like the idea of witnessing a title fight interim or not. I guarantee you if you had 3 round title fights they’d still sell better than non-title headlined shows with few exceptions.
And Meltzer is only partially correct on UFC agreeing to make Hughes/GSP III an interim title fight to get away with it being 5 rounds, Hughes was the one who pushed for it just because he wanted a title fight. They didn’t need for it to be 5 rounds because it was clear from the previous two fights it wasn’t going the distance, especially since it was clear St. Pierre was so much better than Hughes was since he was at the peak of his powers in 2007 and Hughes was on the decline.
And also, Hughes’ gameplan was to catch GSP by surprise like Serra did by every account I heard. So I don’t know where the conditioning talk is coming from. GSP is a cardio machine whether he’s fighting or not, so if Hughes really believed that he was crazy. Just by age alone (nearly 10 years difference) St. Pierre has the stamina advantage with a half-assed training camp or not. Hughes wanted a title.
No, there is no reason to make non-title fights 5 rounds people acting like they were surprised that Evans vs. Rampage wasn’t a 3 round fight are nuts.
The fact is title matches are special because they are 5 rounds, that’s the way it should be this stuff about cherry picking which fights go 5 rounds is silly.
That’s too long. And I don’t think Dana wants to do anything to make Fitch happy.
I’ve said time and time again: if its important enough to headline a PPV, it needs to be 5 rounds.
there is no reason for it to be 5 rounds. by the third round everyone knows whose taking it anyway, so the extra rounds are pointless.
Although this would be hard to implement and I understand this. However, I would like to see more rounds at least in the lighter divisions. This would allow the judges more time to pick the correct winner. It seem at the lighter weight (also in boxing) that there is never that sudden knock out so it comes down to the judges. I would be all for increasing the rounds. It would get guys in better shape as well.