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MMA matchmaking from hell
By Zach Arnold | January 16, 2010
First, Bobby Lashley vs. Jimmy Ambriz and now news of Matt Mitrione vs. Kimbo Slice. I throw my hands up. (Just like I did tonight when I saw the scorecards for the Vanes Martirosyan/Kassim Ouma boxing fight on Saturday night.)
Ironically, I had recently been watching New Japan footage circa 2003 and saw Ambriz in a video promo with Sean McCully in Los Angeles doing a truck power stunt. Of course, this was the heat-up for Ambriz vs. Josh Barnett at the Tokyo Dome. I have nothing against Jimmy getting a payday, but to get booked against Lashley…
So far, the booking in 2010 is the kind that just kills your spirit as a supporter of the business.
Topics: Media, MMA, StrikeForce, UFC, Zach Arnold | 39 Comments » | Permalink | Trackback |
Supposedly Ambriz is out as an opponent. If its for the reasons I’ve long heard rumored, its that Lashley wants soft touches. I’m sure Icey Mike wants the same for Kimbo, and that’s why we get the Mitrione/Kimbo megafight; Mitrione may be the one guy under contract bad enough for Kimbo to beat. I don’t know why they don’t just go bring in/back guys for the purpose of fighting Kimbo. Its not like Houston was being kept under retainer for anything else, was he?
I honestly think Mitrione takes that fight. I can’t imagine if they just wanted to give Kimbo someone easy they couldn’t come up with a recent heavyweight, or another light heavyweight. Give Carmelo Marrero a call.
The Lashley match-ups are pathetic. I’m not saying he should be fighting Randy Couture, but he should be fighting someone ranked near the bottom of the Top 25.
As for Slice-Mitrione, I’m not sure it’s on par with the Lashley match-ups. It’s standards practice for the UFC To match former fellow TUF cast members against each other for their first couple of fights. Is Slice overwhelmingly favored to take that one? If he does take it, he should definitely begin to creep up the HW ranks himself by taking on ranked opponents.
Throwing your hands up? Why? A TUF fighter that got eliminated in the first round against a TUF fighter that made a little farther. Seems like a natural matchup. There are very few matchups out there for Kimbo that are winnable. He’s a ratings juggernaut that they want to milk for as many fights as possible. I think this is a really tough matchup for him.
They are getting Lashley in to get an impressive win and introduce him to the Showtime audience. Then they’ll get him a more competitive fight. One that they can actually promote. Why put Lashley in tough for this fight? It wouldn’t make any sense to get him beat in his first show.
These goddamn promoters keep treating MMA like it’s a business or something.
Tell me how either of the fights mentioned up above is a fight that people give a damn about. Awful.
I take it from your comment above that your problem with the match-ups is that they are not compelling from a marketing perspective?
If so, fair enough – I’d assumed your problem with the match-ups was that they were not competitive from a sports perspective.
I agree the match making for Lashley is pretty wack. However, I see nothing wrong with the Slice/Mattrione fight. That fight is definitely winnable for Mattrione IMO.
At this point people give a damn about Kimbo vs. anybody, and Lashley vs. anybody.
I’m sure you noticed Kimbo drew huge ratings vs. Houston Alexander. So I’d say people give a damn about Kimbo, not so much his opponent. Mittrone has more name value to the avg UFC fan than any comparable heavyweight.
What would be the point of having a Lashley vs. say a Bigfoot Silva on third or fourth from the top on a Showtime show? There will be a lot of curiosity regarding Lashley. Most people have never seen him fight so you don’t need to put him in tough. He alone is the draw.
Matt Mitrione is the kind of guy that Kimbo should be fighting. They have about the same experience and are going to be far from a main event. Nothing freakshow about this.
Also, I don’t know why the 2010 booking is ‘killing’ you, the UFC has already lined up some great cards March through May; even Strikeforce is compiling a good card for CBS.
I for one do not see any problem with either matchup.
Lashley is 4-0 and virtually untested. Who should be be up against? A ranked opponent? And from a marketing/business persective, it also makes perfect sense. Lashley still has to be introduced to the strikeforce audience. Zach, who would you rather see him fight?
And as for Kimbo…the mitrione matchup makes perfect sense. Its not like Kimbo has earned any sort of shot at a top or even a fringe contender… why would should they/we suddenly treat him like he’s really in the heavyweight mix. He’s not.
WEC’s next show isn’t until March in Columbus, and that promotion usually has the best ratio of competitive bouts. Showtime’s main pitch for the Florida show is Cyborg, Herschel Walker, and Bobby Lashley. (Boring.) UFC’s February show in Vegas is Couture vs. Coleman with the winner becoming #1 contender for Lyoto Machida.
I’m middle-of-the-road excited for UFC in Australia. Outside of that, so far there’s not a lot that’s buzzworthy until May 1st in Montreal (Machida/Shogun II and Rampage/Evans). There will be the CBS show in April with Fedor (maybe) and Henderson vs. Shields but they’re going to have to build up a good card there to impress the fans.
1) Lashley is coming out of all of this with a bad reputation that he doesn’t really want to test himself in MMA. If he did this on the local shows, it wouldn’t be much of a story since it will only be his 5th fight. But it is a problem when he signed on for what I assume it a bigger payday, fights on Showtime/CBS, AND is being shown instead of a legit fighter like Jay Hieron.
2) Scott Coker also comes out of this looking worse because he either doesn’t have the balls or the right contracts in place to force Lashley to have a tougher opponent. Not to mention that he shouldn’t have signed him in the first place if he had any idea this garbage of hand picking easy opponents was going to happen. Dana White has said on multiple occassions that he talked to Brock Lesnar before he signed with the UFC. And the jist of the conversation was that Brock would not be getting easy fights and he wanted to make sure he was okay with that. Obviously Coker and Lashley didn’t have that same conversation.
3. Perhaps I’m a Kimbo hater, but I don’t think he is much of a favorite in that fight, which means it is the correct matchmaking.
But really what this is coming down to is that both companies are trying to use star power for fighters who either don’t want to be tested (Lashley) or need to be protected (Kimbo). The only difference is that Strikeforce seems to be making this more important then their actual real fighters like Jay Hieron. Kimbo is there for the ratings, but he is also going to be on a main card with Machida/Rua, Koscheck/Daley, Rampage/Evans, and Cote/Belcher. Not to mention the multiple number of events before and after with legit match-ups like Silva/Belfort, Penn/Edgar, Griffin/Nogueira, and so forth…
Something about having Bobby Lashley and Hershell Walker on the same card gives me flashbacks of EliteXC.
I agree with 45. Jay Hieron is getting screwed AGAIN by Strikeforce. It’s a shame becuase, besides the Lashley and Walker bouts, it’s a pretty decent card. And I want to see Zaromskis spank Diaz. I like Diaz, but Zaromskis is good.
Shame we can’t have Kimbo vs Lashley… 😛
Disregarding the fact that the Ambriz fight has been off since Friday, I have no problem with the matchmaking for either of those fights.
Lashley should absolutly be given an opponant he can ragdoll and pound out. If anything I’d say Ambriz is too much of a risk. This isn’t about giving Lashley a ‘test’ or stepping up in competition, this is about selling him to the Strikeforce viewership.
Bobby has said himself that he thinks he’s two or three fights away from being ready for Fedor. Have him pummel some nobody on the Miami card wade through Ambriz on CBS in April, and the casual fans might agree with him.
Voila, one main event for Strikeforce.
As for Kimbo/Mitrione…I’d rather see him in pointless fights against sloppy brawlers at HW than I would dehydrated and sluggish in pointless fights at 205. At least that way we’ll get a couple of minutes of mayhem and tasty KO to show the grandkids.
Matt will probably get another headache before the Kimbo fight. Lashley will continue to fight “My Buddy” dolls
I honestly think Mitrione takes that fight. I can’t imagine if they just wanted to give Kimbo someone easy they couldn’t come up with a recent heavyweight, or another light heavyweight. Give Carmelo Marrero a call.
Marrero is terrible for Kimbo – he’s a wrestler.
Honestly, Kimbo’s beaten better guys than Mitrione already. He should win. I just think its funny that we have to treat him versus the 1-1 former NFL player as a legitimate MMA contest and not a freakshow. Pretty much any matchmaking for Kimbo is “good”: Ken Shamrock would be good, for christ’s sake.
I think Coker thought all along that Lashley would want bad fighters to fight, he just may not have been aware of how bad. Lashley’s likely goal is to make good money fighting scrubs, then be installed either as an opponent for Fedor or to get into the UFC when they need someone to main event with.
I am pumped for Kimbo vs Meathead! Why are you complaining? Who do you want to see Kimbo against, Fedor? This is exactly the level of fighter Kimbo should be in there against. He actually has a chance to win this.
Re: Lashley, meh who cares. Lashley has dollar signs all over him; you can’t fault him or Strikeforce for not wanting to waste his name losing to some fat guy who nobody has ever heard of.
I think he’s more complaining that we have to see Kimbo at all. I guess he missed the memo that got passed around after the UFC signed him that it was okay to like Kimbo again and to want to see him in crappy fights since, uhh, the “good guys” were promoting him in crappy fights now instead of the fat boxing promoter.
If you want to bitch about Kimbo being in the UFC at all, I’ve got your back. Kimbo’s presence is nothing more than a cheap ratings grab that makes a mockery of the sport.
HOWEVER, given that he is in the UFC and no amount of bitching will change that, Mitrione is a solid fight for him. I disagree that Kimbo has beaten better guys. He has beaten more experienced guys, but Mitrione actually appears to have some talent.
I think Mitrione wins this. He hits hard and has a solid chin. That should be more than enough to beat Kimbo, who doesn’t have the greatest chin in the world or game changing power.
HOWEVER, given that he is in the UFC and no amount of bitching will change that, Mitrione is a solid fight for him
To you and everyone else who likes the bout: Who isn’t a “solid fight” for Kimbo? Obviously every legitimate heavyweight in the world is on that list, but what about lousy heavyweights? Pat Smith is a challenge for the guy; would that be a solid fight? LOL
Another reader with no issues with these matchups.
Zach, I’ve been reading your stuff for a long time so I know how you roll, but your negativity lately has been notable even by your standards.
I think Kimbo/Mittrione is a perfect matchup for those two. It’s going to be the second match probably on the card and the rest of that PPV is going to be awesome.
Lashley’s booking (apparently now canceled) against Ambriz is trash. Ambriz was just being brought in to job. He isn’t a part of Elite XC’s plans. At least Kimbo is fighting guys who are part of the promotion and will move up the ranks if they beat Kimbo. What happens if Ambriz wins does he fight Antonio Silva? Of course not.
Strikeforce is a complete joke. They should just have Lashley fight Herchel Walker and kill two joke fights with one stone.
This is another example of why Brock Lesnar deserves respect. By his 4th fight he was already UFC champ.
Alan,
The major difference between EliteXC promoting Kimbo and the UFC, is that at least in the UFC they’re competitive fights. He was an underdog versus Alexander and he’ll likely be an underdog against Mitrione. Also notable is that Houston & Matt both won their previous fight before fihgting Kimbo. Contrast that with the lopsided losing streaks of Bo Cantrell, Tank Abbott, James Thompson, and attempting Ken Shamrock. And those were main events. I don’t know why everyone is getting all hot and bothered that Kimbo is on a main card. He’s not even in a co-main event. If he can’t hang at UFC level he’ll be gone, until then I’m not crying ‘foul’ everytime he fights.
The major difference between EliteXC promoting Kimbo and the UFC, is that at least in the UFC they’re competitive fights.
James Thompson wasn’t competitive? Thompson was better than Mitrione, IMO. Ken Shamrock is “competitive” too.
I don’t see what the problem is with Kimbo vs Mitrione either.
I just like seeing Kimbo. I don’t care who he fights.
“I agree with 45. Jay Hieron is getting screwed AGAIN by Strikeforce.”
This is actually not true. Part of Dream’s deal to loan Zaromskis was that he was on the television portion of the card. Hieron was offered Zaromskis before Diaz was in the picture, and his manager declined it. I believe it’s in the last Ariel Helwani video interview with Coker.
“This is actually not true. Part of Dream’s deal to loan Zaromskis was that he was on the television portion of the card. Hieron was offered Zaromskis before Diaz was in the picture, and his manager declined it. I believe it’s in the last Ariel Helwani video interview with Coker.”
1) We don’t know if the proposed Hieron/Zarmskis fight was offered as a title fight. That makes a huge difference in whether or not Hieron turned it down correctly. If they offered Zaromskis in a non-title fight, I would have turned it down to if I was Jay Hieron. People are making a lot of assumptions without knowing all the facts. I don’t know all of the facts either, so I can’t figure out if it was the right decision or not.
2) Nick Diaz should not be getting a title shot no matter what. After his last antics, he shouldn’t be rewarded with a title opportunity.
3) Hieron has no business on the undercard when the Walker and Lashley fights are complete jokes. It’s one thing if they made them into competitive fights, but they aren’t.
I understand Lashley and Walker fighting. I really do. But do they have to both be on the same card? And both be given total scrubs to fight? That is the main issue.
As for the Kimbo stuff in the UFC… I’m no Kimbo fan, but he is at least being promoted correctly.
1) He is being given competition that is a real threat to him.
2) The announcers talk about him as basically a novice who is looking to improve his game.
3) He is being placed on the undercard.
That is much different then being given squash fights, being talked about as one of the greatest fighters, and being a main event.
Because I couldn’t give a damn about Bobby Lashley vs. Jimmy Ambriz?
I’ve heard a lot of crazy things said about me over two decades, but I can’t help but laugh about that one.
Who else do you want to pull out of Japan circa 2003 for Lashley to beat? TOA the Samoan Beast? Montanha Silva? Giant Silva?
It would be beyond stupid for Strikeforce to risk getting Lashley beat in his first fight for the promotion. They need to give him several fights where he can look spectacular while building up his in cage experience and MMA skills.
“It would be beyond stupid for Strikeforce to risk getting Lashley beat in his first fight for the promotion. They need to give him several fights where he can look spectacular while building up his in cage experience and MMA skills.”
Yeah, it really hurt Brock Lesnar’s popularity.
I think fans can get over a loss much better then they can get over the feeling that a fighter is being fed cans.
Lesnar is an exception to the rule more often than not. If you have Lashley fight he does not ready to face a high caliber opponent by any means. He is a big potential draw but he needs time and a lot of work on his skills.
I agree with Stephen. I come here about once a week to scroll through what you’ve posted, and always expect some rambling about this or that never living up to your expectations, but getting upset over a ppv undercard fight and lashley? c’mon. Lighten up a bit, it gets tiring reading nothing but crybaby posts.
You can’t solely blame the promotion for who a guy is fighting either. If Lashley has good management they will look to bring him along in his best interests as a fighter. Fighting a high level opponent at this stage in his development is a bad idea.
How about fighting Ricco Rodriguez. Thtd be a good fight. Legit opponent and would give us an idea if where Lashley is in the game.
There’s a lot of crappy guys that would be a threat to Lashley. I’m not sure the guy can beat Waterman, and I think his camp feels the same way.
The (potential) Lashley fight is a joke (if it materializes). There’s a big, big difference from bringing along a prospect at a responsible pace in order to develop as a fighter and therefore picking (an) appropriate (level of) opponents AND putting him in there with a can/jobber/stiff to just pad his record. This is most clearly the latter.
He gains nothing as a fighter (in a developmental sense) from fighting the Yohan Bank’s and Jimmy Ambriz’s of the mma world.
He gains in cage experience without the threat of a loss, he gains confidence with continuation of winning etc. Plus he gets more training time in between these fights without the threat of losing. One of the areas I think Jake Rosholt suffered from what being brought along too fast. The guy had a ton of potential but was being put in dangerous fights from very early in his career against people that were vastly more experienced and is now cut from the UFC before he could ever realize his talents.
The Kimbo/Mitrione fight makes perfect sense. Like them, hate them, respect them or not, they both won their last UFC fights and Kimbo has proven to be one of the biggest drawing fighters out there. Mitrione was the biggest heel coming out of TUF 10, so makes sense to put him up against popular fighter with similar experience. Call me crazy, but I’m pumped for that fight, lol. And hell I’m even semi-excited for Lashley/Ambriz. Lashley is still relatively inexperienced, so he’s gonna get someone like Ambriz or Ron Waterman while they build him up. I mean Ambriz is capable of punching, he KO’d Dan Bobish in less than a minute. It’s not entirely a gimme fight. Now if Lashley is still fighting jabronis in a year, then I think we can complain. Don’t get me wrong, I’d still have much rather seen Lashley vs. Shane Del Rosario.