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	<title>Comments on: The second anniversary of PRIDE&#8217;s death</title>
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		<title>By: Lester Grimes</title>
		<link>http://www.fightopinion.com/2009/03/27/the-second-anniversary-of-prides-death/comment-page-1/#comment-60080</link>
		<dc:creator>Lester Grimes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Apr 2009 00:24:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fightopinion.com/?p=3824#comment-60080</guid>
		<description>How do we really know the PRIDE buyout was a FINANCIAL failure or success?  After all, the UFC is a private company that&#039;s not required to release their financial statements.  Unless someone leaks out Zuffa&#039;s balance sheet for 2007-09, all this rambling about dollars and cents is mere speculation.

Whatever the cost Zuffa paid for PRIDE, it put to death a major or potential competitor.  Did the UFC gain additional PPV buys?  Did they make residuals from the PrideFC library?  

This mass consolidation was bound to happen sooner or later, especially when mergers or buyouts is a common practice for any growing industry (MMA is no different). 

Others can probably claim the UFC made a return of 10 fold, since buying out PrideFC. But in the end, we&#039;ll never be able to prove any point because Zuffa holds their REAL financial performance pretty close to their chest.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How do we really know the PRIDE buyout was a FINANCIAL failure or success?  After all, the UFC is a private company that&#8217;s not required to release their financial statements.  Unless someone leaks out Zuffa&#8217;s balance sheet for 2007-09, all this rambling about dollars and cents is mere speculation.</p>
<p>Whatever the cost Zuffa paid for PRIDE, it put to death a major or potential competitor.  Did the UFC gain additional PPV buys?  Did they make residuals from the PrideFC library?  </p>
<p>This mass consolidation was bound to happen sooner or later, especially when mergers or buyouts is a common practice for any growing industry (MMA is no different). </p>
<p>Others can probably claim the UFC made a return of 10 fold, since buying out PrideFC. But in the end, we&#8217;ll never be able to prove any point because Zuffa holds their REAL financial performance pretty close to their chest.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeremy</title>
		<link>http://www.fightopinion.com/2009/03/27/the-second-anniversary-of-prides-death/comment-page-1/#comment-60031</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeremy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Mar 2009 22:06:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fightopinion.com/?p=3824#comment-60031</guid>
		<description>Alan,

There is another very big difference between Affliction and the WEC: The WEC gets money from Vs. for every show.

Including that money, Zuffa is not losing with the WEC shows. Are they making a ton? No, but the television money is enough to offset the expenses.

One thing that does need to happen is Zuffa getting Vs to spend some money promoting the WEC. It is one of the highest rated shows on Vs, doing far better than their average rating.

The recent WEC attendance has been solid. Good to see that Zuffa realized that those Vegas shows made the WEC look bush league. 

As far as the purchase of Pride goes, it was not a success. I think they should have learned from getting screwed by Sak on the Liddell/Silva match-up and realized that there was a very real chance that Sak and co were trying to screw them again.

That said, nowhere near 70 million traded hands. It might have been 20% of that, but I think the number is lower than that.

A failure? Sure. A disaster? No.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alan,</p>
<p>There is another very big difference between Affliction and the WEC: The WEC gets money from Vs. for every show.</p>
<p>Including that money, Zuffa is not losing with the WEC shows. Are they making a ton? No, but the television money is enough to offset the expenses.</p>
<p>One thing that does need to happen is Zuffa getting Vs to spend some money promoting the WEC. It is one of the highest rated shows on Vs, doing far better than their average rating.</p>
<p>The recent WEC attendance has been solid. Good to see that Zuffa realized that those Vegas shows made the WEC look bush league. </p>
<p>As far as the purchase of Pride goes, it was not a success. I think they should have learned from getting screwed by Sak on the Liddell/Silva match-up and realized that there was a very real chance that Sak and co were trying to screw them again.</p>
<p>That said, nowhere near 70 million traded hands. It might have been 20% of that, but I think the number is lower than that.</p>
<p>A failure? Sure. A disaster? No.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Conceicao</title>
		<link>http://www.fightopinion.com/2009/03/27/the-second-anniversary-of-prides-death/comment-page-1/#comment-60018</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Conceicao</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Mar 2009 12:26:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fightopinion.com/?p=3824#comment-60018</guid>
		<description>If the WEC&#039;s PPV doesn&#039;t draw when they finally decide to go through with it, you can count the days till its contracted into the UFC. The difference between Affliction and the WEC is that the WEC costs a lot less to do, and so they lose less money.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the WEC&#8217;s PPV doesn&#8217;t draw when they finally decide to go through with it, you can count the days till its contracted into the UFC. The difference between Affliction and the WEC is that the WEC costs a lot less to do, and so they lose less money.</p>
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		<title>By: EJ</title>
		<link>http://www.fightopinion.com/2009/03/27/the-second-anniversary-of-prides-death/comment-page-1/#comment-60013</link>
		<dc:creator>EJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Mar 2009 06:27:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fightopinion.com/?p=3824#comment-60013</guid>
		<description>Affliction is losing millions a show and has resorted to doing a kamikaze show to go out with a bang, while the WEC is the premier home for lighter weight fighters and has a positive future they are in no way the same. 

I&#039;m really beyond tired of this myth about Zuffa purchasing Pride being a failure, considering the aftermath it was probably the second smartest business decision they ever made behind TUF.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Affliction is losing millions a show and has resorted to doing a kamikaze show to go out with a bang, while the WEC is the premier home for lighter weight fighters and has a positive future they are in no way the same. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m really beyond tired of this myth about Zuffa purchasing Pride being a failure, considering the aftermath it was probably the second smartest business decision they ever made behind TUF.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Conceicao</title>
		<link>http://www.fightopinion.com/2009/03/27/the-second-anniversary-of-prides-death/comment-page-1/#comment-60001</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Conceicao</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Mar 2009 20:15:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fightopinion.com/?p=3824#comment-60001</guid>
		<description>2/3 of PRIDE&#039;s great heavyweight triumvirate had already bailed to the UFC before the collapse of PRIDE. And you&#039;re right: Most of them didn&#039;t go anywhere or fight for anywhere, either for a resurrected PRIDE or the UFC. Can&#039;t call that much of a success on Zuffa&#039;s part.

The WEC is a success for having become transformed into the USA&#039;s answer of Shooto in much the same way Affliction is a success for providing great heavyweight fights. I&#039;d agree with you in that sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>2/3 of PRIDE&#8217;s great heavyweight triumvirate had already bailed to the UFC before the collapse of PRIDE. And you&#8217;re right: Most of them didn&#8217;t go anywhere or fight for anywhere, either for a resurrected PRIDE or the UFC. Can&#8217;t call that much of a success on Zuffa&#8217;s part.</p>
<p>The WEC is a success for having become transformed into the USA&#8217;s answer of Shooto in much the same way Affliction is a success for providing great heavyweight fights. I&#8217;d agree with you in that sense.</p>
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		<title>By: 45 Huddle</title>
		<link>http://www.fightopinion.com/2009/03/27/the-second-anniversary-of-prides-death/comment-page-1/#comment-60000</link>
		<dc:creator>45 Huddle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Mar 2009 19:26:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fightopinion.com/?p=3824#comment-60000</guid>
		<description>What fighters were defecting before Zuffa purchased?  Most of them didn&#039;t go anywhere.... Didn&#039;t fight anywhere.  Even the guys who weren&#039;t picked up by Zuffa (like Barnett &amp; Hansen), had to sit out for a while.

If Zuffa hadn&#039;t purchased Pride, it is likely that some of the fighters they got, would have signed on with Bodog or others.

And I would say the WEC is a success.  In a 2 year time frame, the WEC has established itself as the home for the top lighter fighters in the world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What fighters were defecting before Zuffa purchased?  Most of them didn&#8217;t go anywhere&#8230;. Didn&#8217;t fight anywhere.  Even the guys who weren&#8217;t picked up by Zuffa (like Barnett &amp; Hansen), had to sit out for a while.</p>
<p>If Zuffa hadn&#8217;t purchased Pride, it is likely that some of the fighters they got, would have signed on with Bodog or others.</p>
<p>And I would say the WEC is a success.  In a 2 year time frame, the WEC has established itself as the home for the top lighter fighters in the world.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Conceicao</title>
		<link>http://www.fightopinion.com/2009/03/27/the-second-anniversary-of-prides-death/comment-page-1/#comment-59997</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Conceicao</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Mar 2009 18:07:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fightopinion.com/?p=3824#comment-59997</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;And Zuffa purchased the WFA &amp; WEC around the same time. Those ended up being great purchases. The WFA gave them Quinton Jackson &amp; Urijah Faber. It also kept Jackson away from other interested promoters.&lt;/i&gt;

I might as well add in for this:

Its tough to picture the WEC as a &quot;success&quot; by any standard other than the one 45 applies (ie: that Zuffa did it). The WEC is another comedic example of people&#039;s willingness to shift blame off Zuffa: It can&#039;t be that bantamweights don&#039;t draw, that the lightweight-light heavyweight classes were clearly inferior and marketed that way and that feeling carried over to the rest of the show, or that the production looks and feels minor league, nor can it be that all of their stars except Faber are black holes of charisma. No, its all Versus&#039; fault, and if it just went somewhere else, and so if we fantasy book a major network wanting it and paying for it, then it would definitely be successful. Or something to that effect.

I do suppose the WFA purchase was a &quot;success&quot; since it was basically intended solely to get a couple contracts. That did lead to the UFC paying someone so that they could pay Heath Herring top end money to get laid on by Jake O&#039;Brien.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>And Zuffa purchased the WFA &amp; WEC around the same time. Those ended up being great purchases. The WFA gave them Quinton Jackson &amp; Urijah Faber. It also kept Jackson away from other interested promoters.</i></p>
<p>I might as well add in for this:</p>
<p>Its tough to picture the WEC as a &#8220;success&#8221; by any standard other than the one 45 applies (ie: that Zuffa did it). The WEC is another comedic example of people&#8217;s willingness to shift blame off Zuffa: It can&#8217;t be that bantamweights don&#8217;t draw, that the lightweight-light heavyweight classes were clearly inferior and marketed that way and that feeling carried over to the rest of the show, or that the production looks and feels minor league, nor can it be that all of their stars except Faber are black holes of charisma. No, its all Versus&#8217; fault, and if it just went somewhere else, and so if we fantasy book a major network wanting it and paying for it, then it would definitely be successful. Or something to that effect.</p>
<p>I do suppose the WFA purchase was a &#8220;success&#8221; since it was basically intended solely to get a couple contracts. That did lead to the UFC paying someone so that they could pay Heath Herring top end money to get laid on by Jake O&#8217;Brien.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Conceicao</title>
		<link>http://www.fightopinion.com/2009/03/27/the-second-anniversary-of-prides-death/comment-page-1/#comment-59995</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Conceicao</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Mar 2009 17:14:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fightopinion.com/?p=3824#comment-59995</guid>
		<description>The argument that the UFC purchase was necessary to prove the UFC&#039;s supremacy is a joke. The top fighters in PRIDE were already defecting and were PRIDE to have simply collapsed and went into bankruptcy/administration, they likely would have ended up where they ultimately did much sooner. The purchase of PRIDE was nothing but a waste of money and time for everyone involved, and the booby prize are the rights to footage of fights no one cares about.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The argument that the UFC purchase was necessary to prove the UFC&#8217;s supremacy is a joke. The top fighters in PRIDE were already defecting and were PRIDE to have simply collapsed and went into bankruptcy/administration, they likely would have ended up where they ultimately did much sooner. The purchase of PRIDE was nothing but a waste of money and time for everyone involved, and the booby prize are the rights to footage of fights no one cares about.</p>
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		<title>By: Zach Arnold</title>
		<link>http://www.fightopinion.com/2009/03/27/the-second-anniversary-of-prides-death/comment-page-1/#comment-59992</link>
		<dc:creator>Zach Arnold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Mar 2009 13:44:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fightopinion.com/?p=3824#comment-59992</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;I&gt;Not to mention that it was a different time in MMA. Bodog, IFL, and others were starting to rise. I forget the guys name, but there was also a guy who was interesting in purchasing Pride, who helped them put on their two Vegas shows. He basically wanted to turn it into a circus act, and had no real clue about the sport.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Without Ed Fishman, they would have been fortunate to do crowds that K-1 used to do in Las Vegas (read: bad).

Ed is no dummy -- once the Japanese didn&#039;t allegedly pay him his fee for the first show, things went south quickly.  If PRIDE had its business in order, he could have taken the operation to Macau, Atlantic City, and other casino hotspots.  

Realistically, he was the only shot they had for expansion once they lost the Fuji TV deal.  But, as we know how the promotion unraveled, even someone like Ed probably couldn&#039;t have saved that sinking ship.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p><i>Not to mention that it was a different time in MMA. Bodog, IFL, and others were starting to rise. I forget the guys name, but there was also a guy who was interesting in purchasing Pride, who helped them put on their two Vegas shows. He basically wanted to turn it into a circus act, and had no real clue about the sport.</i></p></blockquote>
<p>Without Ed Fishman, they would have been fortunate to do crowds that K-1 used to do in Las Vegas (read: bad).</p>
<p>Ed is no dummy &#8212; once the Japanese didn&#8217;t allegedly pay him his fee for the first show, things went south quickly.  If PRIDE had its business in order, he could have taken the operation to Macau, Atlantic City, and other casino hotspots.  </p>
<p>Realistically, he was the only shot they had for expansion once they lost the Fuji TV deal.  But, as we know how the promotion unraveled, even someone like Ed probably couldn&#8217;t have saved that sinking ship.</p>
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		<title>By: Ultimo Santa</title>
		<link>http://www.fightopinion.com/2009/03/27/the-second-anniversary-of-prides-death/comment-page-1/#comment-59991</link>
		<dc:creator>Ultimo Santa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Mar 2009 12:10:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fightopinion.com/?p=3824#comment-59991</guid>
		<description>When PRIDE died, a little piece of my soul died with it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When PRIDE died, a little piece of my soul died with it.</p>
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