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« | Home | »

Brock Lesnar vs. Frank Mir

By Zach Arnold | November 5, 2007

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So sayeth Dave Meltzer. The fight will happen on February 2nd. UFC press release here.

Topics: Media, MMA, UFC, Zach Arnold | 26 Comments » | Permalink | Trackback |

26 Responses to “Brock Lesnar vs. Frank Mir”

  1. doem says:

    good choice for Lesnar
    Frank Mir is a legitimate, yet currently an unspectacular professional fighter whom a 1-0 lesnar can make his bones against

  2. 45 Huddle says:

    I like this fight.

  3. Bryan says:

    It’s kind of a let down from the Arlovski rumor but makes a lot more sense and is a better fight for Lesnar.

  4. Sheldon says:

    Mir’s conditioning has always been a challenge, but I always have a soft spot for his two fights against Wes Sims for pure entertainment value. Plus his submission on Pete Williams is one of the coolest I’ve ever seen.

    It should be a good fight, and will test Brocks BJJ.

  5. David says:

    Hurry up and wait 🙁

  6. I hope Broke loves his arms.

  7. catch says:

    How exactly is this less of a mismatch than Butterbean/Mark Hunt, which the same commission didn’t allow? ACs baffle me. Or maybe it’s just that one was a pride event and this is a UFC event.

  8. iain says:

    This might be a quick sub…

    I’m surprised ufc is all about the lesnar at 1-0 and the pro wrasslin backround. Whatever, I love the freaks. I want that fat romanian(or was it ukrainian?) dude who fought Thompson back. Lungu?

  9. dice says:

    I am with catch on this one. I have a hard time believing that this fight will get the go ahead by the NSAC (has it been cleared yet?). Throwing a guy with 1 MMA fight(a win over someone who is sub .500 nonetheless) against the former UFC heavyweight Champ is a bit of a stretch. I don’t care how far Mir has fallen from his championship days, he is still a threat on the ground which is presumably where Lesnar will look to take it. We have no idea where Lesnar is as a MMA fighter except that he will probably have a strength and wrestling advantage over most of his opponents. His chin? Sub Defense? Stand-Up? Cardio? Those are big questions that have yet to be answered.

  10. Peter H. says:

    Bob Sapp to Japan = Brock Lesnar to America

    I wasn’t impressed with Lesnar’s debut with K-1.

    Mir is a more formidable opponent. I say Mir by Submission.

  11. IceMuncher says:

    I like this matchup a lot. Mir has good skills and a solid reputation, but has looked terribly mediocre in his last few fights. Lesnar has athleticism and a lot of hype, but is unproven.

    I’m hard pressed to think of better matchup, as far as overall name recognition and competitiveness goes.

  12. I was hoping that Mir would be in contention for this fight.

    He’s had a long road (it’s a long way to the top, if you wanna rock and roll) back from his catastrophic injuries, and this fight gives him a high level opponent publicity-wise that will help bring him back out of the dark matches for good as long as he can put up a win or a competitive loss.

    They’re both huge guys, they have styles that SHOULD match up well…you’ve got to think that this one has a really good chance of going the distance though, and Frank hasn’t shown much in the way of endurance since his return. The longer the fight goes, the more I’d favor Lesnar in the decision.

    Of course, it’s always possible that Mir will snap Lesnar’s arm off.

  13. Grape Knee High says:

    Regardless of whether the NSAC ultimately declines this matchup, I think Mir/Lesnar is an intriguing matchup that does not seem lopsided at all.

    I like Mir but he just isn’t all that great. Never was. He broke Sylvia’s arm, but it was mostly Sylvia’s fault for engaging on the ground and then stubbornly attempting to support a 240 lb guy with just his forearm. We’re talking a guy that got destroyed by a journeyman Freeman and could barely beat a not-even-mediocre Sims. In his “prime”, even.

    I don’t think that it’s a lock for either fighter to win. I can see Mir getting a submission using his superior BJJ, but I can also see Lesnar overpowering Mir and mashing Mir’s face into ground beef. Should be an entertaining fight.

  14. The Gaijin says:

    Far less of an issue with this than Arlovski vs. Lesnar.

    Mir stand up is pretty weak, so is his cardio – Lesnar is a much less of a disadvantage and his health is in much less danger.

    My concern was that a guy who’s only background is in grappling fighting someone with a good grappling (sambo) background and dangerous striking. While Mir definitely has a slick submission background, I think it’s something that has far less “health” and “horrible PR” implications than Lesnar getting KTFO’d on what one would assume would be well covered by the media.

    Most likely the worst that will happen to Lesnar is he will get tapped out. If he was in there with Arlovski, the chances of a Johnnie Morton type disaster increase about 100 fold.

  15. Boog says:

    “I am with catch on this one. I have a hard time believing that this fight will get the go ahead by the NSAC (has it been cleared yet?). Throwing a guy with 1 MMA fight(a win over someone who is sub .500 nonetheless) against the former UFC heavyweight Champ is a bit of a stretch”

    Once more: NSAC sanctioned the 1-0 Pe De Pano to fight former UFC Heavyweight Champ Frank Mir.

  16. Grape Knee High says:

    Gaijin, I think you’re spot on on why this fight will most likely be approved — not even considering Marc Ratner’s inside connections. The worst that Mir can do to Lesnar is a broken bone or torn ligament. Nothing life-threatening and certainly nothing fatal.

    The Butterbean/Hunt denial I can kind of understand. On one side, you have Marc Hunt, K-1 champion and MMA veteran. On the other, you have a sideshow boxer in Butterbean who couldn’t even beat a 155-lb grappler in MMA. It could have been a slobberknocker of epic proportions, but also one with potentially far more dangerous consequences.

  17. dice says:

    “Once more: NSAC sanctioned the 1-0 Pe De Pano to fight former UFC Heavyweight Champ Frank Mir”

    That same commission nixed butterbean/hunt, which would have been fine, and was much closer on paper than this matchup (ON PAPER). I am also guessing that the commission thought cruz’s world class grappling skills were good enough to allow the fight to happen. Lesnar has national wrestling skills (he is less accomplished than say a couture, angle, etc.) but nothing in the grappling or striking arena, which allows a fighter to be offensive instead of pulling a koscheck.

    Actually allowing the cruz/mir fight is a good indication of how little I trust the NSAC. Mir was still a gimp and was fighting way too soon after having his leg broken like that.

    My guess is that this fight will go through simply because of the close ties the UFC has with the NSAC.

  18. The Gaijin says:

    We’re all better off not seeing a freakshow fight like Hunt vs. Butterbean anyways.

  19. dice says:

    GKH

    Hunt is not what I would have called a MMA veteran, he had 7 mma fights at the time, almost all of which were against stand-up fighters (cro cop, wandy, nishima). His loss was to yoshida, who was a much smaller grappler.(meaning that both of them have a weakness when it comes to grapplers)

    I don’t know how it would have had “dangerous consequences”. We knew a lot more about butterbeans skills back then than we do of lesnars skills right now. Butterbean has a ridiculous chin, one that could have easily matched hunts. I think hunts ground game is better than butterbeans, but not to the point that it would have been a mismatch. Remember butterbean actually had a few submission victories at that point, proving he at least had some knowledge of the ground game. We literally have no idea where Lesnar is skill wise. Chin? Stand up? Sub defense? Cardio?

    ps The NSAC then allowed butterbean to fight sean Ohaire, a pro wrestler who had 2 mma fights and no stand-up or grappling credentials to speak of. Of course the fight ended in less than 30 seconds by TKO. My point being that butterbean/ohaire is a much bigger mismatch than butterbean/hunt.

  20. Grape Knee High says:

    No doubt the NSAC is inconsistent in applying whatever standards (if any) they are using to approve/decline bouts.

    Who would have won a Butterbean/Hunt matchup, I have no idea, but my guess is because both of them are standup fighters, chances are greater that a brain injury could have happened to one of them. And, I’m just conjecturing that they declined this bout because of Butterbean’s relative lack of experience, rather than Hunt’s.

    The good thing about a Mir/Lesnar matchup is that the worst thing that could possibly happen to Lesnar is a broken bone or torn ligament; nothing as serious as brain injury. Gaijin made a great point that Mir is definitely a better matchup for Lesnar than Arlovski, who theoretically could pound the snot out of Lesnar.

  21. I’m not sure what you mean by “on paper.”

    “On paper” you’ve got a washed up former champ who’s been a shadow of himself who may or may not be able to squeeze out a win, and you’ve got a two year older former pro wrestler with hardly any MMA background, but a solid amateur wrestling resume.

    They’re of similar height and they’re probably going to cut to similar weights (I think Frank’s gained a few).

    Who’s the “on paper” dominator? I’m having trouble telling.

  22. The Gaijin says:

    I assume in the case of Hunt/Butterbean they likely felt Hunt’s resume was far stronger in terms of “mma experience” based on the overall quality of his opposition vs. Butterbean who had faced a varying degree of diminitive Japanese opponents, cans and Cabbage in a mixed rules match.

    I assume they just looked at it on paper and decided they didn’t like it – I’m sure if DSE had the ears of a few ppl on the commission the story might be different, but overall and in retrospect, it’s not that big of a blight on the commission.

  23. dice says:

    My guess would be the guy who we have seen fight before.

    When I am talking about “on paper”, I am not talking as much about height and weight as MMA record or lack thereof in this case.

    I will say it again, we know what Mir is capable of, we have no idea what lesnar is bringing to the table. I haven’t said a word about who will win the fight. I am simply stating that its a risk to throw someone in the cage against a former champ when you have no idea how good he is.

    No one even has seen Lesnar throw a punch, take a punch, defend a submission or fight for more than 3 minutes. There are a lot of guys who are big strong wrestler’s who’s skills didn’t transition that well to MMA. Some writer (can’t remember who) stated that Sylvester Turkey could have just as easily have the same amount of potential as lesnar (if not more). And If lesnar was to fight turkey tommorrow, I would pick Sly.

    Lesnar could be the next big thing….or a the next big bust. You are throwing him in there with a guy who has snapped a limb before. There is a definite risk for any heavy when on the ground with mir, Hardonk just about lost his shoulder in mir’s last fight.

    So yeah I would say “on paper” it looks like a mis-match, since neither you or anyone else knows what lesnar is capable of.

  24. dice says:

    To gajin

    Do you think that hunt/butterbean would have been more of mismatch than butterbean/Ohaire?

  25. The Gaijin says:

    Personally, no I don’t think so.

    Do people who likely knew little about mma in general and are appointed know much different from looking at guys credentials on paper?

    More than likely not.

    They probably looked at Butterbean and O’Haire’s records at the time the fight was to take place (both pretty lean and full of people they’d never heard of or undersized Japanese opponents) and thought it was a more fair fight than Hunt vs. Butterbean.

    Myself I think Hunt/Butterbean was far more fair than O’Haire/Butterbean, but I cannot say that I find it totally unreasonable that people saw it the way they did.

  26. The Gaijin says:

    Also, doesn’t O’Haire have a decent amateur background of some sort??

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