Does Zack ghost write at Sherdog by any chance?

Median total household income in the United Stats is $46,326.

Is 8/8 a reasonable figure? Assuming that your average fighter wins half his fights and fights four times a year, he’d be earning $48,000 per year before sponsorships (and how much are these guys earning for sponsorships? Are they paid by the appearance, or do they have term contracts?) and bonuses.

Some people would argue that because fighting is inherently dangerous (something they’re happy to turn around and minimize when talking MMA vs. boxing), and professional athletes have short professional careers, that they should make more than that.

If UFC provided all fighters the option to participate in an unmatched 401k, and gave them 100% medical for 10 years following their retirement, would that make up the difference?

Plus there is the point that there is a tiered system in place. Typically, by the time someone is ready to fight for a belt, they’re doing OK for themselves (barring idiots who act as their own manager, seriously guys, get a freaking lawyer), and when they’re a name brand in the title fight on the card, they’re able to pull down some serious moolah.

There should be a reasonable bottom limit, but I think that it is highly unlikely that we’d all agree on what it is, because no one knows what’s in the contracts, we don’t have reliable information on bonuses, we have limited information on what fighters are getting from sponsors, and some people just have unreasonable views on what the average person in the US is really making.

IMHO, 3k is too little, and 8k to 12k is about right, and I think that fighters should all be permitted to participate in a 401k, and the ability to vest into a decent health plan.

If a fighter refuses to fight for UFC because he wants better than his 3K to show/3K more to win, there will be 100 other fighters willing to stop in and take that shot, for the exposure and the chance to become the next Liddell or Hughes, money-wise.

There would also be 100s of fighters willing to do it for free.

But at some point, it just seems like smart business sense (especially from a PR perspective) to pay what people would perceive as a competitive salary to its low-end fighters.

Just seems a couple extra thousand bucks would go a long way toward curbing come of the criticism the UFC has to deal with on a daily basis.

Not all safety advances are purely research oriented.

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but the idea that boxing is beyond being able to do anything to protect its fighters, or that racing fans have a special bloodlust or ignorance that boxing and MMA fans are devoid of is actually really hilarious.

Once again, I’m asking for specifics on how to protect the fighters beyond the factor of human error/incompetence (which can only be corrected in an administrative capacity). It’s nice that you’re trying to continue this ‘argument’, but I’ve seen nothing discussed regarding how slovenly Boxing has been with regards to research on preventing brain damage. As I posited before, so long as you can hit a guy in the head with a gloved fist, there will be concussions that can lead to brain damage and possibly death. How can we solve this short of banning it entirely? I’m interested in hearing.

Ultimately both require money and time. Not all safety advances are purely research oriented. They’re often well known in advance of when it is deemed “necessary”. Multiple drivers died in NASCAR from basal skull fractures in the years immediately prior to Dale Earnhardt’s death, and the HANS device was originally designed in the mid 1980s. It was only upon the death of their biggest star that it was forced upon NASCAR that changes needed to be made. I understand that you think racing is for the lower class or animalistic (especially funny, particularly when you consider how big boxing and MMA are in Monaco compared to racing), but the idea that boxing is beyond being able to do anything to protect its fighters, or that racing fans have a special bloodlust or ignorance that boxing and MMA fans are devoid of is actually really hilarious.

The obvious answer is to do better neurological screenings before fights and to give the doctor more leeway in stopping fights, perhaps even recommending that he do so more often. There has to be more willingness on the part of commissions to cancel fights that are not competitive. The fact is that most fights that turn out fatal or extremely dangerous are seen as such far in advance by casual fans. How many times do we need Teddy Atlas screaming out that a fight should be ceased before it becomes obvious to commissions? There are lots of problems and no serious interest from anyone to try and reasonably fix them. When Indonesia was having 4 deaths a year, at least some of the sanctioning bodies refused to do business there until things changes. There has been no such reform here.

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Nobody in racing dies from extended periods of repetitive head trauma. You don’t wreck for 36 minutes straight. There are most assuredly things that can be done, its just that no one wants them to be accomplished. Are you telling me that the injuries sustained to Victor Burgos recently could not have been avoided by an earlier stoppage?

Both your counter-arguments deal with human error/incompetence rather than a mechanical defect or impurity in the sport itself. Bad reffing, doctor stoppages and match-making by the commission can only be fixed by clean-ups from those commissions or possibly federal intervention (as Teddy Atlas always argues). It has nothing to do with a lack of R&D into softening the blows, which was what your comparison to NASCAR would have required in order to be a valid analogy, hence my refutation.

The obvious answer is to do better neurological screenings before fights and to give the doctor more leeway in stopping fights, perhaps even recommending that he do so more often. There has to be more willingness on the part of commissions to cancel fights that are not competitive. The fact is that most fights that turn out fatal or extremely dangerous are seen as such far in advance by casual fans. How many times do we need Teddy Atlas screaming out that a fight should be ceased before it becomes obvious to commissions? There are lots of problems and no serious interest from anyone to try and reasonably fix them. When Indonesia was having 4 deaths a year, at least some of the sanctioning bodies refused to do business there until things changes. There has been no such reform here.

Apples and oranges. Cars can be modified to try and protect the passengers and there is a constant evolution of automobile technology. There is no way to stop the concussive damage of a punch in Boxing
(besides banning it as a whole).

Nobody in racing dies from extended periods of repetitive head trauma. You don’t wreck for 36 minutes straight. There are most assuredly things that can be done, its just that no one wants them to be accomplished. Are you telling me that the injuries sustained to Victor Burgos recently could not have been avoided by an earlier stoppage?

The difference in boxing versus racing is that there’s been very little done to actually prevent fatal injuries or long term neurological damage in boxing,

What, exactly, can be done to stop the concussive force of punches in Boxing? The concussions are caused by the momentum (mass x velocity) of the gloved fist hitting the head, with the kinetic energy of the strike causing the brain to rattle. I don’t really think there’s any real way of preventing the brain damage inherent in Boxing (besides banning it altogether), unless you have some sort of new study that shows otherwise…

F1 spend probably half a billion dollars on car and track improvements. The NSAC mandated 10oz gloves for smaller weight classes.

Apples and oranges. Cars can be modified to try and protect the passengers and there is a constant evolution of automobile technology. There is no way to stop the concussive damage of a punch in Boxing (besides banning it as a whole).

Compare the difference in safety features for tracks and cars in 1994 when Senna and Ratzenberger died to what the NSAC did following two deaths on their watch a couple years back. F1 spend probably half a billion dollars on car and track improvements. The NSAC mandated 10oz gloves for smaller weight classes.